Re: Some Bay Area tea shops

DogMa,

Thanks for the comments. I'll be in SF next week, and I planned to visit Red Blossom, having recently purchased two reasonably-priced gaiwans from them.

I always make a pilgrimage to ITC whenever I'm in town - the prices are high, but so is the quality. The last time I was there I got a Baozhong that was IMHO just about perfect: balanced, floral and good for 6-8 steeps. At $20/oz though, it ought to be :).

I don't like drinking from gaiwans either, but I assume I can ask for a cup to decant into.

Dean

I happened to find myself in the SF area for a photonics conference (as one >so often does), and managed to drop into a few tea spots between wavicles. >There seems to be a proliferation of such, similar in style but very >different in atmosphere. In case it's useful to anyone, here are a few >sententious comments: > > - Imperial Tea Court, Chinatown and the Ferry Building. > I prefer the original location for dimmer, quieter, more retreat-like > atmosphere. The new location is separated from the (rather classy) Ferry > Building mall by not much more than a partial lattice, and on this nasty > January day was reasonably quiet but frigid. Have yet to meet Roy Fong, > who seems ever to be in the warehouse or out buying; but Grace is a > charming presence. They have a bunch of above-average pots and other > useful teaware, though the best pots are NFS. Plenty of tea on offer in > both locations, at high prices - generally, however, commensurate with > quality. Tastings are a bargain by comparison. Service by elegant young > men. (Why so rarely women in this business?) > > The Ferry Building ITC location has a fair amount of food on offer; most > people there seemed to be more dining than drinking. Combined with > admittedly pleasant aromas from the center's other food and personal-care > vendors, I found this to be somewhat distracting. Personally, were I in > that neighborhood, I'd save my caloric quota for Yank Sing, an upscale dim > sum house in the heart of the Rincon Center complex. Beyond the HK-class > food, there's a kind of waterfall from the atrium ceiling that adds good > feng shui or something. I can't speak for their tea, since I'd brought a > very nice (code for "wanted it back right away") new Yixing pot and a bag > of SRT's cheapest but IMO best-tasting fenghuang dan cong for my host. > > I was somewhat uncomfortable with the instructional style, which I did not > experience directly (being a take-charge kinda guy) but repeatedly > witnessed. My impression was that both server/teachers and customers were > getting lost in mannered ritual at the expense of the tea. Watching people > awkwardly slurp from gaiwans instead of decanting was vicariously > embarrassing - nothing wrong with the act, but it was clearly out of > character for those partaking. Worse, they seem to use near-boiling water > indiscriminately. When I asked for something much cooler for our long jing > (a delicate green), I was politely asked what temperature I'd like - a > good response, but the wrong place to start. (I just asked for a pot of > cold water to mix ad lib.) I'm wondering how many people who start the cha > dao here (or in many other places) ever learn that green tea does not > taste like spinach? Even many oolongs can't take this treatment. As long > as I'm ranting, I'll also complain about the gaiwan we were given, much > too large for the amount of leaf it contained. I dropped a broad hint, and > was offered another a good 10% smaller. > > - Red Blossom Tea Company, Chinatown. > This tiny, deep shop has just a couple of tasting tables between rows of > paraphernalia, with most tea in the back. Pots and gaiwans fairly priced, > though most a bit fancy to my taste. Not exactly a secluded experience, > right on Grant St., but pleasant and informed service. And the staff > seemed able to establish a quiet zone around each table. > > - Vital T-leaf, two Chinatown locations (head office in Seattle). > The main store is a magnet for extroverts, open to Grant St. and with a > riotous agglomeration of 20-something passersby enjoying free rounds at > the bar with the friendly energy of a post- (winning) game beer crowd. > Staff young as well, with Benihana-type cheerful showmanship blending with > as much serious information as people seemed able to absorb. A very large > range of teas, many flavored (not my cuppa) and flowers/herbs (even a > couple types of kuding) in tins and open trays, which may be OK if > turnover is high. Many Pu-erhs also on display, including presentation > bing and zhuanchas of at least two kg and a 30-yo shu cake for $380. > (Latter was plastic-wrapped, so the aroma was inaccessible. Looked > authentic, though.) Many pots at fair prices, though again only a couple > I'd want. My sense was that the staff was entirely prepared for a much > more serious tasting experience during times quieter than a Saturday > afternoon. > > A couple of blocks uphill is a more intimate satellite shop, with a > representative stock (including the $380 shu bing) and less riotous > atmosphere. > > - Teance, Berkeley. Best for last. > This was supposed to be the penultimate scene of a day's nostalgia tour of > Berkeley, following a walk around the Vine St. Gourmet Ghetto-as-was > (where I used to buy coffee in his one shop from Mr. Peet) and before > trooping up Grizzly Peak for a characteristically stunning sunset. A > careful drive along Solano failed to produce this establishment, even as > an emergency call to Joe K. confirmed the location. Fortunately, my > friend's Blackberry was web-enabled, so we were able to discover that they > had just moved down to the Flats. The unprepossessing neighborhood > prompted speculation about marketing mistakes, but their new (of two > months) home proved to be in the middle of a cluster of assorted shops and > restaurants fine enough to qualify the whole as a Destination. > > Teance offers a stylishly sparse ambience reminiscent of, but more elegant > than, the late Wild Lily Tea Room. The front is an open shop, with an > appropriate number of teas and some nice teaware of diverse styles - the > celadon (per former establishment name) perhaps the best on offer; three > exceptional Yixings were unfortunately NFS. > > The tasting area is a single circle of about a dozen seats in several > nicely designed stations, so as to be serviceable by one or several > people. Tasting are again a bargain for the quality. Our server, one > Darius (I forbore the bibulous pun about one man's Mede being another's > Persian) seemed quite well informed about the qualities of his stock, and > helped us to a selection of interesting oolongs. Aware that we were not > ignorant of technique, he also offered a broad range of pots and gaiwans, > as well as mixing and serving gear. > > I was concerned at how empty the place was, given a sunny-Sunday mob in > the environs. Perhaps they do mostly a take-out business. At least until > it's (re-)discovered, though, I'd make it a top choice for area visitors > with transportation. > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > > On a final note, I stopped into a number of Asian grocery stores, > apothecaries and tchachke shops in the ongoing quest for cheap'n'cheerful > shu Pu-erh to bring to Chinese restaurants. Every such place I looked had > one, and only one, cheap bing on display: a 340g "black tea" from Hung > Chong Tai in HK, of which maker Samarkand has written on RFDT: > groups.google.com/group/rec.food.drink.tea/msg/3a2c4b18381e83ac. Is this a > conspiracy? I did finally do the experiment of asking a back-alley TCM > outfit for something better, but that's another story. > > DM
Reply to
DPM
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The last time I was at ITC in the Ferry building, I ordered a gaiwan of a yan cha. I asked if I could have a reserve pitcher to decant into. I was told that I would have to pay for a gong fu service, and they don't offer that to individuals. I gave the server a puzzled look and seitched my order to a green tea and proceeded to sip from the gaiwan.

-D

Reply to
Davelcorp

Following my note of 1/29/07, I've been fascinated by remarks on- and off-list. Some people seemed to find the OP useful. Many immediately criticized the quality, presentation or practices at various establishments. Others leapt to the defense of their favorites shops.

One does not expect even-tempered commentary on Usenet. At least I owned up to "a few sententious comments" - i.e., frankly opinionated and not comprehensive.

IMO, "real" shop/restaurant reviews require a perspective and objectivity that require multiple visits at different times of days, days of the week, times of year, and company. (And then the issue is complicated by familiarity with the proprietors.) Mine were summary comments on hasty visits, only one to a place I'd been previously.

Likewise, discernment and subject-matter expertise are critical (so to speak), though not necessarily in equal amounts. My taste sense is apparently much less capable, and certainly less educated, than those of many people here. My knowledge of tea is yet several orders diminished. However, we probably all share an equal capacity for absorption in tea and tea service, and in the enjoyment thereof.

I wouldn't presume to doubt anyone else's experience. My current favorite oolong is a commercial product from Anxi, which I suspect costs about a buck a box (over there). I have had nastily mediocre dan congs in the $300/lb range even from the much-reputed Silk Road. The two teas I tried at Teance were excellent, and the oolong I sipped at the Vital T-leaf was perfectly acceptable. Possibly I got lucky.

However, I was not in any event writing formal reviews; rather, offering some semi-qualified options for anyone else who might be visiting the town, and to start comment (which it did). After some of the adverse responses, I had a look at snapshots from the Vital bistro. Here is what I see: a SRO full house, with every guest smiling or laughing. Staff of diverse ages entirely attentive to and respectful of guests. A balance of just-plain-fun and gentle education. A lot of tea in glass-fronted bins, some open, and a lot more better protected.

I'm not trying to "sell" any establishment. I consider ITC to be overpriced and pretentious, and in the Ferry building case deficient in atmosphere. I consider Red Blossom to be far more serious and welcoming, but a little claustrophobic (though probably much nicer on a weekday). I had a good time with a friend at Teance. I did not even sit down at Vital T; too rambunctious by far. But the people there were having a wonderful time. All of them. And what's it all about, anyway?

One thing I've found in several decades of globe-trotting gourmandise is that many different networks will reliably guide one to the "best of" - and that's without even the Web. Forums like this are a great vehicle for exchange of delights. Perhaps it's useful to bear in mind that we all have different tastes and standards. Short of deceptive practices, which get "outed" pretty quickly, it's all a matter of taste. Let's help each other - including lurkers and future readers of the archive - to have fun in whatever way and at whatever level suits.

-DM

Reply to
DogMa

On Mar 3, 6:31 am, DogMa wrote:

Although, I am pretty new to all of this, I admit: yes, I am a tea snob. Initially, I had criticized Mr. Fong for his secrecy. However, the quality of the teas I've had from ITC, for the most part, have been fairly priced (just a little high) and very, very good - especially his Imperial selections. After all, an oz. of most teas goes a way. I do enjoy the honesty, knowlege and care with which the proprietors of Red Blossom approach their business. It is a crowded shop, yes; but, it's nearly impossible to get decent space on Grant Street that doesn't "cost an arm and a leg". After all, they inherited the space from their grandpa and dad when it was just a little Chinatown herb store. As for my criticism (subjective as criticism is) of Teance or Vital, I have frequented them often.I gave it a good shot. I live here in Berkeley and at least twice a week head off tea shopping, either nearby or in one of our two Chinatowns. There are better, cheaper, fresher places in the area. And, too, Vitals are very highly priced and do cater to the tourist trade in Chinatown. My main objection to Teance is that their teas sit out in their bins for quite a long time. They are ALL prepackaged and the sample you get in a tasting is not always the product you take home in the sealed bag, since all their teas are prepared in their warehouse. Personally, I like to buy a little of this, a little of that and have the vendor package it in front of me, especially if I've had a tasting of something in the store. When I shop online, I tend to go to vendors I've done considerable business with, as well. Who's to say that being really fussy about the quality and care of tea isn't fun? And, you're right: it is all matter of taste. As far as ITC in the ferry building goes: unfortunately, they will not be there much longer. ITC and all the other wonderful purveyors will be relocating because the building will be closed and may or may not (depending on the decisons of the City Council, earthquake preparedness and funding) re-open. If it fails to re-open, it will be sorely missed by all of us that live here and those who visit. BTW, glad you got to spend some time in our great area of the world. Shen (fast-becoming a committed tea snob)

Reply to
Shen

I agree regarding Teance. I've had good green teas there and a nice charcoal roasted TGY but their puerh and some of their oolongs are not the best tasting; not because the tea isn't of high quality but I think it gets stale in some part of the process. They are nowhere near as good as ITC's best selections or some of the internet purveyors in my humble opinion.

Reply to
Danica

I know I need a long time to make up my mind about any tea. So much so, I've given up and enjoy the provenance as much as anything else. Each one of my teas has a story. My local tea shoppe isn't how I would run a tea shoppe. I'd dump the silly little pots and replace them with a 1 liter glass carafe with a gill strainer and a webcam. I don't have to pay the bills. My local owner has fullfilled his vision of an English tea shoppe full of women with money to spend. I duck in there time to time to see what new is on the shelves and get a cup to go. A Nilgiri green hit the spot this morning. It's been on my C list for a year. I enjoy the stories and experiences of fellow tea drinkers in this group. The only taste buds that count are mine.

Jim

PS I was rearrang> Following my note of 1/29/07, I've been fascinated by remarks on- and

...I know where to look...

Reply to
Space Cowboy

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