Fining before fermenting?

I cannot comment on the extraction process but Jack does a lot of experimentation with these things and I would suggest you follow his suggestion.

If you first batch is not tart enough it is a simple matter to add a bit of acid to it. You could measure the TA with an acid kit and add enough to bring it up to where you want it or you could simply do it by taste. Add a bit of tartaric until it brightens a to close to where you want it. Put it back for bulk aging for a few more months to let the acid incorporate fully and try it again to do a final adjustment. This is common procedure for wine makers.

Ray

The tartness I'm speaking of comes from the Sumac seed coverings themselves. I've made Sumac-aid before, and it'll sure make you pucker. I'm using a different technique than Jack uses.

I twist and break the clusters, then rub the smaller cluster pieces together, and comb the seeds off the stems. The first batch, I just used too much water. I poured about a half gallon of water over the seeds, and it was tart then, but when I poured the second half gallon over the seeds, It didn't have that lemon taste. At that point it was too late.

After reading more about Sumac online, I learned that you can't really go by weight. The tartness depends on when you pick them, how much rain they got before you pick em etc. You just cover the seeds you have with water, and let them sit over night. I think I have enough seeds this time, so I can reuse the same water on several batches of seeds to get the tartness I want. If I have some seeds left over, I'll try hot water and the egg whites or whole milk, just to see if it works. I'm hoping the hot water will extract more color as well.

I d>If you first batch is not tart enough it is a simple matter to add a bit of

I used to make sumac lemonade when I was a kid and I do think your soaking method is better. If you simmer too long it does get bitter and it's just too late to fix it. You can't go by color, you have to taste it. The bottle washer is around $10 US and is a great investment. I lend my corker to coworkers and friends until they know they are getting into this for real, maybe you can find a local to borrow the corker from.

Joe

I just fill a container full of clusters and cover them with COLD water. Wait 15 minutes and then bash the day lights out of them with an old wooden masher. If the juice isn't strong enough for my taste, I just throw in some more clusters. And bash some more . I then strain off the juice through a cheese cloth and let it sit overnight before straining it again. Some junk will settle out over night . In my cooking pot I bring it up to just past steaming , not boiling , for 5 minutes and add the sugar etc.. Cool and cast the yeast , After a week into the secondary. Make sure you use a malic tolerant yeast .

Makes good jelly too.

I'm not too sure about the pie:)

The jelly is good and a friend used some to baste a pork roast. She said it was excellent. The wine I have is now 2 years old and is very good , like a sherry , much changed from when it was made. I used Laven

72B and some nutrient., 3 lbs of sugar for an imperial gallon . As an aid to get the yeast going I used a couple of small , sliced lemons floating in the primary with the yeast sprinkled around and on top of them. I tried for 12% , my local wine store says it's 18%. But I think they're high .

Mine finished and sparkles a clear pale orange colour. I didn't use any campden , just heated it and made sure everything was nice and clean. My notes say it started @ 1.105 and I stopped it @1.01, 35 days later. Racked it into secondary after 6 days. No one knows what it is and I usually give them a small sip to see if they like it. Nine out of ten times they say "More please":)