Teahub puer..any opinions?

Melinda -

My policy is always to boycott the online vendors who has different pricelists for different countries. I have no problem with additional postage and handling charges for sending international. But believe me - they do not sell this tea to Chinese-speaking public for $60. So every time you see the web site without openly posted prices for all their products - you are being taken for a ride. Just click them away.

Sasha.

Alex ChaihorskyTTMfd.12029$ snipped-for-privacy@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com10/27/04

Sasha,

Could you be much more specific in your contention about dual price systems at TeaHub? $60. for 500 grams of this particular tea strikes me as quite reasonable, but of course we'd need to have a go at it before judging. I wouldn't click them off that quick.

Michael

While it is certainly normal for different products to be priced differently in different countries by the companies that have presence there (prices for real estate, warehousing, taxes, employee salaries, etc), online trade is geographically blind (with exception to shipping charges). Therefore if you see a tea sold by a Chinese company online without listed price (we will send you the pricelist) that means that they have at least two pricelists - for Chinese and for stupid rich laowai. There is no other logic behind not having their prices posted online. And while its their right to do business that way, it is ours not to play stupid. If you take a look at this company site you will see that almost all of their prices are not listed.

If you buy from David Hoffman at these prices it is understandable - he has a huge Californian overhead, taxes, etc.. But you also get the service, reputation, return policy, etc. He stores the teas in caves, some of them being aged for quite some time, so you can buy the same tea several years later. None of that is known or possible with the online web-based vendor who can disappear as quickly as it appeared. Anyone who spent at least a day in China knows - milking a stupid laowai is a national sport. Paying US prices for online purchases is bad business. Unless being stupid laowai somehow appeals to someone.

Sasha.

Alex ChaihorskyIONfd.35250$ snipped-for-privacy@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com10/27/04

While you could be quite right in your assessment, there are any number of reasons why a company might not post prices on the internet.

Are you quite sure those of us who buy from this company are stupid? Is it possible that we have compared their prices for specific teas with other companies and have consulted our friends in China?

I apparently know more about those caves than you do. But, don't let that worry you. (I frequently purchase teas from David Hoffman.)

Which is why it pays to know your vendor.

I feel so bad now, Sasha. I was having such a great morning, and you brought me down.

You used the word "stupid" four times. I'm smarting from the blows.

Michael Stupid Laowai

Trying to think of some, I keep coming up empty. Can you help, Michael (or anyone else?)

/Lew

Name one. :) There also has to be an explanation why none of the other online tea (and non-tea) retailers do that.

Michael, I am sorry - I never mean for you to take this personally. But if your mean to tell me that your friends in China tell you that a $60 for a fresh regular 500g beencha is a good price, they most probably mean 60 yuan, not 60 DOLLARS (500 yuan). Believe me, a tea has to be of a very exceptional quality and at least already be aged 3-5 years (just to know if it ages well, and there is nothing that indicates that in its description) to warrant such a price. You do realize that an engineer in Beijing makes about 2,000 yuan /month so that tea will cost him one week of his salary (about $1,500 in our scale). Also it must be stated that one does not have to be "stupid" to buy overpriced items. Some of us (God bless them) are so fortunate as not to even look at the price for the items they really like.

And that was meant to say what? :)

Why? Big deal - they have had you for awile! May be for - God Almighty - couple of hundred bucks! One cannot know everything and I also paid ridiculous prices for things Chinese before I actually saw them sold 10 to

I should not have and I apologize. I did it because that is the expression I heard many times from Chinese in China (since nothing in my appearence betray my knowledge of the language) - "Hey sister (say, to a waitress that serves me in a restorant) - get some real money out of that rich stupid laowai!". BTW - its is my advice to everybody who goes there - always smile and thank waitresses each time she serves you tea or next dish(Xixie, xiaojie - thank you young lady) because Chinese never thank servers and they love you instantly for that. I had my bills from expensive hotel restorants halfed and dissapeared completely from my final hotel bill thanks to that. If you go there often bring some small gifts to your favourite people at the hotels and restorants that you frequently go to. You will thank me many times for this advice.

Sasha Suspects that he still qualifies as a "Stupid Laowai" despite his "knowledge" :)

Why not have a Chinese request the prices for a few Teahub offerings and report to the group? Didn't Samarkand claim a Chinese origin?

--crymad

BTW, if you go to that page where they describe this tea

Sasha.

This is pretty damning. Still, getting that "friends and family" list would remove all doubt.

--crymad

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:

Weird conception of business... In market economy (and it's market economy in China), the market fixes the price. Regardless of costs of productions of the service/product.

Why wouldn't they ? They probably don't live only on occasional internet retail sales into the US, it's logical they favor their main customers that allow them to pay their rent and food.

I have 3 price lists, and I have to change them often. I have not 3 grades of stupidity among customers, but 3 very different levels of services. Anybody doing a business of anything has a unique pricelist ? If yes, you're lucky.

Sasha reading in minds !

-Prices fluctuate daily (that's the case for wholesellers of products that are perishable and with a changing market).

-They list many products, but they don't keep all of them in stock, so if you order, they call their supplier to check the current prices and availability.

-Customers want to know prices in their currency, and the change rate fluctuates. It's a loss of time to calculate in advance for products you don't sell often to a given country.

One reason for my own business (I try to remedy...) :

-They have not the means (knowledge,time, quick connection..etc) to update a webpage more than once in a blue moon. So it's easier to send the prices on request by mail or even to send a catalogue.

One reason certain persons I know have, but that's more unlikely for tea :

-They don't want competitors to know easily all their price list, so they give to customers only the prices of the few articles/services they are interested in. Even if they publish a price-list, it is "decorative" and you rarely get the announced price. Many hotels do that as they are *fighting* for the big deals with travel agencies and congresses.

I don't order much online or by the phone, unless it's standardized products like ink for my printer, etc. Puer and vintage teas are a special case, but for other teas, I find it a bit *weird* that so many on-line retailers advertise teas at constant price all year. I mean I don't mind if it's Lipton Yellow tea bags. But tea leaves can be fresher or older, no ? So I tend to think that the good on-line tea sellers are the more "flexible" about pricing. You can shop around to check the market prices if you think they are cheating on you.

Kuri

I've seen different lists for different regions, maybe each one is in the nationa currency so you don't need to look up exchange rate? Just a guess.

-ben

Just noticed that Linda's original response to Alex (Sasha)'s untruthful, irresponsible and biased comments was not picked up by many newsgroup sites. Here is the original post:

Hi Sasha,

This is not the first time that you bashing us on the net. Although I tended to dust off your nonsense comments, I'am totally fed up with your stupid, yes, stupid comments this time.

Luckily, there are lots of Chinese or somebody that can really read Chinese out there, the very last sentence on the Chinese pop up page said "配 套的竹盒可用作茶盘，价格另计。 ", which means that "the matching bamboo box can be used as a tea tray, and its price is not included". I know that it is election year in US. I guess that taking things out of context is not the unique talent of politicians. Be my guest, ask some real experts to translate that sentence for you.

Obviously, you are a real "Lao Wai". You do not really know China, Chinese or Chinese culture to the extend that you claimed. You limited past experiences do not represent present China. And your limited foolish experiences in China do not represent China overall.

With the bamboo box, the Golden Da Mo is selling at RMB880 each to the Yunnan government. Go ahead, call them up to verify.

Linda

I love this. The essence of this dispute can be put into a political commercial:

Heavy melody of the "March of Trolls" from Grieg's "Peer Gynt" created the atmosphere of fear and hopelessness... Camera: Recent US elections, angry candidates, typical capitalist faces - distorted, shouting... dark, gloomy shadows... Me, (sitting in front of a monitor in a black tophat and penguin suit, fat capitalist pig talking in a disgusting high voice) : "Since TeaHub does not post their prices online, I suspect these guys have multiple pricelists and their prices for westerners are much higher". Music becomes louder and louder, there is no hope, no hope at all... Suddenly an a flash of light, a giant figure of a worker with a "TeaHub" handband, his face full of dignity and disgust, pointing his finger at me (giant red flag behind him, sun flooding his side of the picture, leaving mine dark and murky): "That is because you are stupid, foolish and ignorant LaoWai!". A giant broom wipes me out. Thousands of oppressed American workers escape the dark, running, running... they buy tons of teas from smiling TeaHub worker and walk into the red, shiny sunset. In Chinese version the music plays "Big sword chops devil's heads". In international version its the "Vincero, vincero", the final crescendo from "Nessun Dorma" (Turandot, Puccini) The End.

1. She is referring to a different site or something, but I have saved the phrase that I translated, so anyone who wants I can e-mail it to you and you can translate it yourself.

1. As you can see there is a lot of anger here and a raw nerve is touched. It is up to you to decide why.

2. Certainly the easier way would be just to have their prices listed online, like all the other vendors do.

1. What you, my friends, witnessed here is a rare case of "loosing face". Happens very rarely with simple folks in China and practically never with educated and cultured Chinese. Calling people stupid or fools, etc. is the last stage of desperation and lack of arguments.

2. With all my deep respect for Chinese culture and China's recent moves away from Communist dictature, listening to that US elections bashing is beyond funny. As Kerry said "it's like listening to Tony Soprano lecturing us about lawlessness". Sorry, Linda, this ain't gonna fly here.

1. Read carefully that passage about me being a "real Lao Wai" and the "recent China". At least its an admission that there was such a way to treat laowai "before". But "now", of course, everything is different, honest and kosher. Any foreigner who visited China RECENTLY knows that this is a very naive propaganda. Well, its up to you, folks - you heard both sides.. The difference between TeaHub and me - I have no financial interest in bashing ort promoting TeaHub. They do have an interest to bash me - pronouncing me stupid and ignorant idiot allow them not address the real issue. Since TeaHub is such an expert on American election system, may be it is time for them to learn how people vote with their wallets.

Sasha.

P.S. Linda, you would do much better if you'd be polite, nice and just post your prices online. Calling me names and NOT posting your prices just proves my point.

Alex ChaihorskyjMlid.4569$ snipped-for-privacy@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com11/4/04

major snippage

more snipage

Michael

I think it is fair for me to post the results of a little experiment I conducted in response to Alex (Sasha's) accusation of double-pricing by Teahub. That is, he stated that the lack of a price list on their web site constituted evidence of their bilking Westerners by sending one price list to Chinese customers and another (assumed higher) to Westerners.

I asked a student of mine to request, in Chinese and from his hotmail acount, a price list for their teas. Teahub sent him the same English list they sent me and said they didn't have one in Chinese. So it sounds like the web site is export only and I conclude, in the absence of any other evidence, that this accusation is false.

Best,

Rick.

Hi Sasha, I'm not getting into this debate, just reading through all the posts.

Actually, Linda is right in pointing out the mistake in your mention about the pop-up box, the one about "priceon separate list". 2 things here:

1. 'Jia Ge Ling Ji' means "the price will be calculated differently", it isn't the same as "price on a separate list" as you translated.

1. you translated half the sentence, the other half before 'Jia Ge Ling Ji' says that 'The accompanying bamboo case can also be used as a tea tray"

2. In full the sentence reads: The accompanying bamboo case can be also be used as a tea tray, the price of which will be calculated separately.

Unless they have changed the box message, the above would be what I've read. Whether Teahub sells their teas with different pricelist for different clientale, I'm not sure.

Oh BTW, crymad is still itching about my chinese origins. Poor thing, please move on.

:")

Samar

Yes, we should bury our quarrel and have dinner together sometime, Samar. Chinese, of course. I can teach you how to use chopsticks. It's really easy!

--crymad

And I can teach you how to speak in fluent mandarin over dinner. You have to teach me something new, I taught laowais in Hongkong how to use the chopsticks with two fingers, not the entre hand clawed like a foshou fruit.