First 24 hours

Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I stirred well.
Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary fermenter bucket?
Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal carboy.
Thanks
Reply to
russ
Opinion is pretty well split down the middle on this. People also say that there is enough oxygen in the must ( in the water and added by the mixing and splashing ) to provide the yeast with a good reproductive bath! In my earlier days I used to cover my fermenting bin with a muslin cloth ( to keep out bugs etc) but these days all my wines be it kits or country wines go into a fermenting bucket which has a tight fitting ( and sealed) lid with a fermentation lock. If there is a need for more oxygen with country wines then they get it when I punch the cap down daily. But all my wines made from juices of various kinds are under a fermentation lock from day 1. And it works -- so there must be enough oxygen in the must ( pun intended!). Not yet had a failure to ferment out! I also like the idea that my must is well protected by a CO2 blanket which itself is protected by a secure fermentation lock right from the start. Now that hasn't really helped has it! ;-} -- Trevor A Panther In South Yorkshire, England Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply. All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton Anti Virus for your protection too! > Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz > cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic > enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I > stirred well. > > Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the > primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net > says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid > reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and > leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary > fermenter bucket? > > Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal > carboy. > > Thanks >
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Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
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Reply to
pinky
What do you mean by "punch the cap down daily"? Am I supposed to do something daily to it? I didn't think I was.
Reply to
russ
No you have no cap to punch down! That refers to when you are making wine out of fruits and during the first week of fermentation the CO2 gas escaping from the must forces all the fruit to float to the top and creates a "cap" -- i.e. made out of all the fruit. It is necessary to push this cap down back into the must and break it up every day so that all the goodies are extracted by the fermentation process! You are making wine out of just juices and there will be no "cap" to worry about. -- Trevor A Panther In South Yorkshire, England Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply. All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton Anti Virus for your protection too! > What do you mean by "punch the cap down daily"? Am I supposed to do > something daily to it? I didn't think I was. >
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Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
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Reply to
pinky
> Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz > cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic > enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I > stirred well. > > Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the > primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net > says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid > reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and > leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary > fermenter bucket? The books I have read on the subject are not unanimous, but most recommend that the primary fermenter should allow oxygen in to get the production of yeast going well; after a large population of yeast forms (two or three days), then cut off air supply. When atmospheric oxygen is available, the sugars and oxygen in the must will be used to create more yeast; when the atmospheric oxygen is cut off, the sugar and oxygen in the must will go into alcohol and carbon dioxide production. If you have five gallons of must in a seven or eight gallon wide-mouth container, a loosely fitting lid on the container will keep out dust and bugs. When left undisturned, the space between the surface of the must and the lid will be filled with carbon dioxide and will cut off atmospheric oxygen fairly well (that's how the ancient peoples used to ferment juice). Once the furious initial bubbling seems to be decreasing, then give a good stir and put an air lock on it. But then, I have never made any wine, so my suggestions are purely book-reading. > Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal > carboy. > > Thanks
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*"But then, I have never made any wine, so my suggestions are purely book-reading."* I bow to your obvious superior knowledge. I have only been making wine for about 35 years. -- Trevor A Panther In South Yorkshire, England Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply. All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton Anti Virus for your protection too! > > > > The books I have read on the subject are not unanimous, > > But then, I have never made any wine, so my suggestions are purely > book-reading. > >> Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal >> carboy. >> >> Thanks > > --- >
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Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
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Reply to
pinky
You come to the expert armatures and you get no consensus. For my part, I vote with Jack. The first few days of fermentation are probably going to be very vigorous and you need a lot of head space so the method I was taught is to keep it in a food safe bucket about twice the volume of the must. This allows air to get to the must AND it prevents a major mess. Then when fermentation slows down and it is important to keep air away from the must I rack to a secondary with a small head space and use an airlock. I recommend that you find an easy to follow, easy to read, and well accepted book that outlines the basics of winemaking. It will probably have the basics on a few pages. Follow these procedures at least for your first few batches. Another good way to start is to make a few kit batches. They give very specific instructions and will get you following some good basic rules. Incidentally, all kits I have seen follow the open air method. Ray > Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz > cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic > enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I > stirred well. > > Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the > primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net > says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid > reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and > leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary > fermenter bucket? > > Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal > carboy. > > Thanks >
Reply to
Ray Calvert
Not the ones I use! Including Winexpert. But Ray is just as sensible as am I ( well most of the time). What it does show is that wine, during its But this really is an area where there is a deal of disagreement between all sorts of winemakers -- even commercial winemakers do "closed" fermentations. All I can say is that I have never have a failed fermentation -- not ever. I have used both methods ( and I never had an "infection" when I just covered with muslin for the first week.) But if you are use just Juice I would prefer the closed method So who is right. In the end the process of making wine is amazingly resilient anyway. As I have said, in a roundabout way, I haven't had a failure in either way -- so why take the risk In the end I strongly suggest that you follow the instructions implicitly in the wine kit instructions -- they are generally foolproof from old and bold wine makers -- and they work! -- Trevor A Panther In South Yorkshire, England Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply. All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton Anti Virus for your protection too! > You come to the expert armatures and you get no consensus. For my part, I > vote with Jack. The first few days of fermentation are probably going to > be very vigorous and you need a lot of head space so the method I was > taught is to keep it in a food safe bucket about twice the volume of the > must. This allows air to get to the must AND it prevents a major mess. > Then when fermentation slows down and it is important to keep air away > from the must I rack to a secondary with a small head space and use an > airlock. > > I recommend that you find an easy to follow, easy to read, and well > accepted book that outlines the basics of winemaking. It will probably > have the basics on a few pages. Follow these procedures at least for your > first few batches. Another good way to start is to make a few kit > batches. They give very specific instructions and will get you following > some good basic rules. Incidentally, all kits I have seen follow the open > air method. > > Ray > > wrote in message > news:1110163205.806726.300960@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... >> Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz >> cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic >> enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I >> stirred well. >> >> Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the >> primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net >> says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid >> reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and >> leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary >> fermenter bucket? >> >> Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal >> carboy. >> >> Thanks >> > >
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Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
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Reply to
pinky
> Not the ones I use! Including Winexpert. > > But Ray is just as sensible as am I ( well most of the time). What it does > show is that wine, during its Thank You Trevor (I think?) THere are differences of oppinion here, but, as you say, wine making is an amazingly forgiving hoby. But as both Trevor and I have suggested, pick a reputable set of instructions, as in a kit instructions or a good book, and follow them to get started. There are many ways to make wine. But you should be carefull about mixing methods untill you know what you are doing. Ray >
Reply to
Ray Calvert
I agree with what's been said previously, but I would just add a note of caution about some juices out there. Just watch to make sure your fermentation starts within the first 24 hours. If it does, then don't worry about it. I've noticed with some frozen concentrate juices that they are adding something to the juice, which slows or prevents fermentation in a closed container (with a bung & airlock) but works better in an open container (covered in plastic, which you can stir and allow access to oxygen) & yeast energizer. Now, I don't use regular Welch's juice or other juices, so I don't know if the company has been adding stuff to those juices which would slow or prevent fermentation. Good-luck. Darlene Wisconsin > > "pinky" wrote in message > news:s23Xd.397$Qb2.142@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk... >> Not the ones I use! Including Winexpert. >> >> But Ray is just as sensible as am I ( well most of the time). What it >> does show is that wine, during its > > Thank You Trevor (I think?) > > THere are differences of oppinion here, but, as you say, wine making is an > amazingly forgiving hoby. But as both Trevor and I have suggested, pick a > reputable set of instructions, as in a kit instructions or a good book, > and follow them to get started. There are many ways to make wine. But > you should be carefull about mixing methods untill you know what you are > doing. > > Ray > >> > >
Reply to
Dar V
OK. One last question. How often can I pop the lid on the primary fermenter bucket and look at it? Is it OK to do this every few days or will that be a bad thing?
Reply to
russ
If there are bubbles being pushed through the airlock, that means your fermentation is going. So I wouldn't open it up, until the bubbling in the airlock slows way down and you're ready to rack to a secondary container with very little head space. Do you have a hydrometer? Do you know what your starting SG is? If your airlock isn't bubbling within the first 24 hours, I would pop it open to see what's going on. If it is foaming a little bit then your fermentation may be just slow. If nothing is happening, then get back to us. I do stir my wine made from frozen juice concentrates twice a day, that's why I don't use an bung & airlock on my primary ferments, but that's my preference. Hope this makes sense. Darlene Wisconsin > OK. One last question. How often can I pop the lid on the primary > fermenter bucket and look at it? Is it OK to do this every few days or > will that be a bad thing? >
Reply to
Dar V
Hi Russ,
As long as it is early in the primary fermentation, and you have vigorous bubbling, there is no harm in "popping the lid" as often as you want, because carbon dioxide is providing a protective layer over your wine (just dont take too deep a sniff!). When the bubbling becomes less vigorous, there is less carbon dioxide to protect the wine, so you should do fewer inspections. When the bubbling begins to calm down, you should use your hydrometer to take a specific gravity reading. When it is down to 1.005 SG (or about 1 degree Brix) you should rack it to your secondary fermentor, fill to the top and put on an airlock.
Best Regards,
Gary Charlotte, North Carolina
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/ > OK. One last question. How often can I pop the lid on the primary > fermenter bucket and look at it? Is it OK to do this every few days or > will that be a bad thing? >
Reply to
Gary
I don't have my notes here, but last month we were given a seminar by Clayton Cone, the yeast guru at Lalvin, and from what I remember he recommended 2 days or so of open air contact for best fermentation results. This doesn't mean closed ferment wouldn't work, just that free air contact is safer, especially for tricky musts. Pp > You come to the expert armatures and you get no consensus. For my part, I > vote with Jack. The first few days of fermentation are probably going to be > very vigorous and you need a lot of head space so the method I was taught is > to keep it in a food safe bucket about twice the volume of the must. This > allows air to get to the must AND it prevents a major mess. Then when > fermentation slows down and it is important to keep air away from the must I > rack to a secondary with a small head space and use an airlock. > > I recommend that you find an easy to follow, easy to read, and well accepted > book that outlines the basics of winemaking. It will probably have the > basics on a few pages. Follow these procedures at least for your first few > batches. Another good way to start is to make a few kit batches. They give > very specific instructions and will get you following some good basic rules. > Incidentally, all kits I have seen follow the open air method. > > Ray > > wrote in message > news:1110163205.806726.300960@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... > > Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz > > cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic > > enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I > > stirred well. > > > > Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the > > primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net > > says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid > > reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and > > leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary > > fermenter bucket? > > > > Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal > > carboy. > > > > Thanks > >
Reply to
pp
Russ, I think Ray said the most important thing, and that is to make sure you have plenty of space in your carboy to accomodate the fermentaion. It also depends on the yeast you used. Some foam A LOT and you need a lot of head space, some don't foam at all and you can get away with less but I wouldn't worry too much about air getting to your ferment if it is in a carboy. There will be so much CO2 in the carboy while fermentation is going on, oxygen will not be able to get near the top of the must. I've never had any problems fermenting in "open" containers. Just monitor the fermentation and decrase the headspace as the fermentation slows down. Bob > OK. One last question. How often can I pop the lid on the primary > fermenter bucket and look at it? Is it OK to do this every few days or > will that be a bad thing?
Reply to
doublesb
When the fermentation is really going I like to stick my head really close to the top of the must and inhale until I almost pass out. Firstly, I love the smell of fermentation and I suggest you experience it also and secondly, if you almost pass out that meansa there is plenty of CO2 protecting the wine so you don't have to worry. Actually, I use this test everyday and decide to rack to secondary based on my smell tests. I know most won't recommend that technique , but it works for me. Never had a wine oxidize yet.
Bob
Reply to
doublesb
I used 1 packet of "premier cuvee" in my 5 gallon blueberry wine batch. I rehydrated it in warm water and then mixed it in before putting the lid on.
Reply to
russ
>Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz >cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic >enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I >stirred well. > >Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the >primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net >says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid >reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and >leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary >fermenter bucket? > >Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal >carboy. > >Thanks
Fruit Wine Recipes using Real Fruit Puree There are many ways to make wine with the purees. It comes down to personal preference. Oregon Fruit Products one gallon recipe (see chart) calls for one can of puree with enough sugar to bring the original gravity to 1.090 or higher. This produces a wine with an alcohol level of 12% by volume and will remain stable for a long time
To make a fiuit wine comparable to using a 96 oz. can of wine base, use two cans of Oregon Fruit Products Puree per five gallons and enough sugar to bring the gravity to 1.090 or higher. Add natural fruit flavoring enhancers to bring out flavor and give more aroma. Add sugar gradually both initially and for sweetening. Add 1/2 the initial sugar and take a gravity reading or taste if you are sweetening a finished wine before adding the rest. This will insure that your wine doesn't come out too strong. Fermentation will stop automatically, but wine must be stabilized with potassium sorbate if sugar is added after fermentation for sweetening. This will prevent renewed fermentation. Use an open plastic bucket for a fermenter. For one gallon batches it is best to use a two gallon bucket and for five gallon batches, use a seven gallon bucket. Sterilize your fermenter and any equipment that will come into contact with the must. Dissolve the sugar and additives in a quart of warm water. Add the fruit puree and enough water to equal one gallon total volume. Add the other ingredients except the yeast. Stir well. Take a gravity reading. The must should be between 1.090 and 1.100. If it is lower, add enough sugar to bring the gravity up. Approximately 4 oz. of sugar will raise the gravity 10 points in one gallon of water. Make up a yeast starter using Red Star Cote Des Blancs or Lalvin 71B-1122 yeast and add to the must. If your bucket does not include a lid, cover the fermenter with cheese cloth or a fine nylon mesh straining bag. This allows the must to breathe. Stir must every day for 5 to 7 days (until the gravity is about 1.030). Rack into a sterilized one gallon jug or three gallon glass carboy (depending on volume made). Attach an airlock and ferment for 2 to 4 weeks or until fermentation is complete. The gravity reading should be 1.000 or lower. Rack wine off the sediment into another sterilized gallon jug or glass carboy. Add a fining agent according to directions and let set for 4 weeks. The wine can be bottled when it is clear and stable. For a sweeter wine, dissolve 2 to 4 teaspoons of sugar in 1/4 cup warm water. Add 1/2 teaspoon potassium sorbate to the wine and then add the sugar mixture to wine.
Reply to
A. J. Rawls
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> >>Im new to winemaking and making my very first batch. I used two 49oz >>cans of oregon blueberry puree, 10lbs of sugar, warm water, pectic >>enzyme, acid blend, grape tannin, super yeast, and wine yeast. I >>stirred well. >> >>Now, the place I bought the stuff said to put the airlock on the >>primary fermenter as soon as I am done mixing it up. Jack Keller.net >>says to let it sit for 48-72 hours to assist the yeast in rapid >>reproduction. Which is correct? Should I go pull the airlock out and >>leave the airlock hole open to allow oxygen to get in the primary >>fermenter bucket? >> >>Any other advice? In 5-7 days I'm going to syphon it into my 5 gal >>carboy. >> >>Thanks > >Fruit Wine Recipes using Real Fruit Puree There are many ways to make >wine with the purees. It comes down to personal preference. Oregon >Fruit Products one gallon recipe (see chart) calls for one can of >puree with enough sugar to bring the original gravity to 1.090 or >higher. This produces a wine with an alcohol level of 12% by volume >and will remain stable for a long time > >To make a fiuit wine comparable to using a 96 oz. can of wine base, >use two cans of Oregon Fruit Products Puree per five gallons and >enough sugar to bring the gravity to 1.090 or higher. Add natural >fruit flavoring enhancers to bring out flavor and give more aroma. >Add sugar gradually both initially and for sweetening. Add 1/2 the >initial sugar and take a gravity reading or taste if you are >sweetening a finished wine before adding the rest. This will insure >that your wine doesn't come out too strong. Fermentation will stop >automatically, but wine must be stabilized with potassium sorbate if >sugar is added after fermentation for sweetening. This will prevent >renewed fermentation. >Use an open plastic bucket for a fermenter. For one gallon batches it >is best to use a two gallon bucket and for five gallon batches, use a >seven gallon bucket. Sterilize your fermenter and any equipment that >will come into contact with the must. Dissolve the sugar and additives >in a quart of warm water. Add the fruit puree and enough water to >equal one gallon total volume. Add the other ingredients except the >yeast. Stir well. Take a gravity reading. The must should be between >1.090 and 1.100. If it is lower, add enough sugar to bring the gravity >up. Approximately 4 oz. of sugar will raise the gravity 10 points in >one gallon of water. Make up a yeast starter using Red Star Cote Des >Blancs or Lalvin 71B-1122 yeast and add to the must. If your bucket >does not include a lid, cover the fermenter with cheese cloth or a >fine nylon mesh straining bag. This allows the must to breathe. Stir >must every day for 5 to 7 days (until the gravity is about 1.030). >Rack into a sterilized one gallon jug or three gallon glass carboy >(depending on volume made). Attach an airlock and ferment for 2 to 4 >weeks or until fermentation is complete. The gravity reading should be >1.000 or lower. Rack wine off the sediment into another sterilized >gallon jug or glass carboy. Add a fining agent according to directions >and let set for 4 weeks. The wine can be bottled when it is clear and >stable. >For a sweeter wine, dissolve 2 to 4 teaspoons of sugar in 1/4 cup warm >water. Add 1/2 teaspoon potassium sorbate to the wine and then add the >sugar mixture to wine. >
Reply to
A. J. Rawls
That's a low foamer. You could get away with less head space. If your using a carboy , I would think that if the carboy was filled to the shoulders , you'd have plenty of room. BTW, your wine will most likely be dry as a bone when done.
Bob
Reply to
doublesb

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