Newbie question

Portable? Excel?!

OK, I've counted to ten and calmed down. Look, Excel is portable only in an all-Microsoft world. Leaving aside all the, uh, philosophical objections many people have towards a Microsoft monoculture, you don't have to be a very keen observer of the world of computing to realize that Microsoft's power and reach have ebbed over the last several years.

Sorry about what might be considered off-topic ranting, but we *are* talking about a potential tool for those reading this newsgroup.

/Lew

I'm with you, Lew, but had to count to twenty. Whatever solution members of our group adopts shoudl be very simple. Smartphones have a long way to go in terms of display, true compatibility and even data entry. Relastional DBMS would be a complete overkill -- we are not talking about hundreds of thousands of records, with complex query needs and conditional Boolean search features, plus why would anyone need to normalize the data as tables? I suggested a straightforward Micorosoft Works DB option, which is not portable, however. I assumed that all PCs come with Works but that may be incorrect.

A tea DB is basically just a simple set of records, so all that is needed is a simple data entry mechanism, search capability and display output. The only non-simple issue is coming up with a list of the fields and keys you want to use.

Not unless there's more than one user/taster. Do you want to foreclose that possibility at the outset?

One reason is that you might want to be sure when you're talking about the same thing and when you're talking about different things. For a concrete example, there's the exchange I had with LurfysMa about purchases (or lots) vs. types of tea.

Well, that's one way to do it, and a valid way, but hardly the only one. There are lots of free-form blogs featuring people's tasting notes out there. I read some of them with pleasure and profit. But I fear that a quick-n-dirty "database" for tea tasting would suck all the flavorsome virtues out of the blog approach without much offsetting usefulness.

/Lew

I created a 'personal' stand-alone 'Tea Journal' using MS Excel using many of the fields suggested by the other members, but, since I'm an ol' mainframe programmer/analyst who now uses MS Access frequently at work, the Access DB idea sounds great.

er yea, it is actually quite portable Lew, and it's not restricted any more to Windows platforms (at least in the mobile device space). But I was actually thinking of a Windows Mobile or Palm based PDA/Phone. There are even viewers for Symbian based devices. These all handle basic spreadsheets remarkably well but you may have a point when it comes to handling Excel applications, those with embedded controls and code etc.

I port many spreadsheets to my Windows Mobile based phone and also did so on my old Palm device for years (using a 3rd party Excel viewer - later versions of which actually allowed you to read/edit excel files in Windows Native mode). Viewing and editing was very simple, but as you say, screen size is an issue.

If the tea application we are discussing requires a few bells and whistles, then I concur that Excel is probably not the way forward. If the potential users want something that is very simple (and perhaps readily portable), then maybe Excel is an option.

Just a thought, not an edict.

Cheers Mal Oz

yay ! ..go Big Blue !..

Cheers Mal Oz (...going back to hide under the Z890 now...)

Right; we don't do edicts around here. Wait - was that an edict?

/Lew

Excellent this sounds great let me jump in :o)

I agree with Mike in that the focus for this should remain a personal journal application, which as he says would be easily portable to a community database in future if demand is great enough. Lots of other fantastic ideas coming out of this though but probably best to keep the focus on what is a nice simple but useful personal tool... and yeah the relational database will be good for searching, matching... especially if adding/growing the functions in future.

I reckon we need a table for 'Tasting Notes' as part of the ratings process:

It could be split into the three main categories of:

1. Dry Leaf - (consisting of) a.) Desirable characteristics: Curly, wiry, neat, blackish, bloom, clean, leafy, nose, tip, well twisted b.) Undesirable characteristics: Mushy, ragged, grey, light, uneven c.) own notes

1. Infused Leaf - (consisting of) a.) Desirable: biscuity, bright, coppery, smooth, self drinking, full, rich, soothing, smokey b.) Undesirable: dull, dark, tarry c.) own notes

2. Liquor / Brew - (options consisting of) a.) Desirable: body, bright, brisk, character, coloury, muscatel, point, pungent, quality, strength, thick, flavour, full, malty, mature, self-drinking, smokey b.) Undesirable: baggy, bakey, bitter, brassy, burned, coarse, common, dry, dull, musty, plain, raw, soft, stewed, sweaty, taint, weedy, thin, earthy, empty, fruity, hard, harsh, heavy, lacking, green (referring to black tea) c.) own notes

Any other characteristics as there are so many descriptive terms!? ...........................................................

Also a 'Leaf Grade' table with the usual suspects:

Pekoe TGFOP Orange Pekoe (OP) Fannings Dust Loose Tea Processed Tea Souchong Broken Grades

etc.......

..........................................................................

And finally a few options like:

1.) The ability to select or de-select a particular tea as a favourite (general and/or within specific tea category) so your not searching through the whole history later to find them.

2.) The ability to add the teas origin estate / grower... especially as I for one am big on 'Single Estate' or 'Single Region' tea... and within that to be able to say whether it is processed Organic, CTC, Fair Trade, Ethical etc ..........................................................................

Ok sorry that's enough from me I think :o)

Jon

I'm afraid many of the words in this list of tea tasters' terms of disapproval appliy to black tea almost exclusively. In other genres of tea, "bitter", "soft", "earthy", "fruity" could be fine.

/Lew

Hi Lewis, sure... indeed it could be sub-divided into a selectable list of terms for specific types of tea. Perhaps you can provide a more complete list of terms for the database related to Chinese teas, 'Desirable' & 'Undesirable' - Chinese teas are admittedly not my area of expertise :o)

Jon

Leaving out the Origin? I'm surprised. Country Region Plantation Harvest Processor ...stuff like that

| >> >One of our Pu-erh gurus developed such a system a couple of years back. | >> >I saw the alpha version, and thought it excellent. Don't know if he | >> >plans to release it generally. He'll reply here if he wants to. | >>

| >> Here's hoping he sees this and has something others can use. I'm a | >> mediocre database programmer ;-) | >

| >I believe Dogma was referring to me. I wrote a Pu-erh Collectors | >database a while back to keep track of my Puerh collection. It is | >primarily a "collectors" database which concentrates on tracking teas, | >vendors, and individual pieces of "inventory" much like a stamp or | >coin collection application. It is not a Tea "Taster's" database by | >any means. | >

| >Due to some personal reasons, a recent death in my family, I really | >could use a diversion right now. I would be willing to write a | >database application using MS Access runtime components. I am fairly | >adept at writing User Interfaces in Access and wouldn't mind creating | >a Personal Tea Tasters DB. It would only be for the PC platform | >though, sorry all of you OS-X users out there. | >

| >Anyway, bounce it around on the group for a while and collectively | >come up with a set specifications, or general wish list, of which | >features are: | >a)mandatory | >b)would be really nice | >c)throw it in if you feel like it. | >

| >Then when the thread settles down I will whip up something based on | >the groups consensus, and throw it out under a Creative Commons | >license. | >Call it my contribution to the group.......... | >

| >Mike | >

| | | --

I had a girlfriend who sent me email that I never could read. It was usually just a few symbols. She never asked me why I couldn't read it and I guess she couldn't read mine either. Short relationship there. This isn't supposed to happen in the MIME world, is it?

| > But hey, irrespective of the outcome, some great ideas and enthusiasm here. | > Cheers | > Mal | > Oz |