+/- $200 wine to drink now

One word:

Gaja.

Chris Sprague wrote:

(Maine)

You should be able to find a bottle of 1996 Grange for $200 and it's reaching it's optimal drinking window provided that it was properly stored.

Gaja indeed---talk about successful marketing. Gaja & Bruno Ceretto in Piemonte and the Marchese della Incisa (Sassacaia) and Antinori have done more to raise the prices of the best Italian wines then anyone, even Robert Parker. When I first met Gaja in 1982 he was represented by a small importer, Gabriella Cantoni who introduced his wines in most markets, he told me then he thought if Bordeaux and Burgundy could command top dollar in the American market, why should the best of Italy. At the time only Biondi Santi approached the $100 mark. By the time I returned in 1985, Gaja had already created his cru's and moved beyond Gabriella for distribution and Bruno Ceretto told me that his 1982 Bricco Rocche Bricco Roche would retail for $100 in the US. This is when Sassicaia was $70. They transformed the pricing of Italian Wine and when Mark DeGrazia had his clients create great Vino di Tavolas (aka Super-Tavola) like Clerico Arte and Il Palazzino Grosso Sanese in barrique a whole new market exploded.

In 1985 Gaja squared off against the late Luigi Veronelli about his bottling of Cabernet Sauvignon and chardonnay at an intimate dinner for 100 catered by Gualitero Marchese at Vin Italy. Many of the producers there who sided with Veronelli later produced barrique wine and even chardonnays!

On one hand I abhor paying $200 for a bottle of Gaja's good stuff, but salute him for evening the international playing field.

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Why not Vega Sicilia Unico? It is released ready to drink at about 10 years age, so you should be able to get something like 1994 or earlier. www.wine-searcher should direct you to an available bottle in the US, but there are probably lower prices to be found elsewhere. hth Anders

Hello Chris,

That sounds like a really fun idea.

I can't say I've ever drunk anything in the $200US range myself.

I can suggest an Australian site that might be a bit of help.

Go the "red wines" or "white wines" section and have a look through the super premium sections. Probably best to look through the imports, as they are more likely to be found in the US. Although there will be some premium reds you can find over there from Australia.

All prices are in Australian dollars, and we get about 75 US cents to the dollar. They are quite good on price, so it will give you a rough idea at least.

The notes on the wines are pretty good too. The advanced search function might help you out a bit too. Its an interesting site, even if it doesn't help all that much in the end.

That's about the only help I can give you, unhelpful as it may be. I hope you come back and tell us how it went.

Mat.

Chris Sprague wrote:

Lots of good questions. You sound like a younger group than most of us here - not that that's bad. I've been where you are now, but with a somewhat smaller budget.

I think you should go straight to big California Cabernets. On a par quality level, you'll get more bang for your buck than from comparable level French wines. Don't pass up the occasional good deal on a nice Bordeaux though.

For $50 to $150 you can get some mind bending Napa Cabernets/Bordeaux blends. Over that range, I'd recommend the usual (in alphabetical order):

Beringer (Private Reserve or Special Selection or ??) Burgess Vintage Selection BV Georges de Latour Cakebread Caymus Special Selection Chateau Montelena Clos du Val Dunn Freemark Abbey Groth Heitz "Martha's Vineyard" Joseph Phelps ("Insignia" or "Backus Vineyard") Louis Martini (try the Cabs, but _buy_ the Moscato Amabile! Oops - never mind. They won't ship the Moscato. Bummer.) Mayacamas Mondavi Reserve Opus One Raymond Ridge Monte Bello Ritchie Creek Sawyer Shafer Silverado Silver Oak Smith Madrone Stag's Leap Wine Cellars V Sattui (mail order only)

This is by no means a complete list. Those are just the ones I could remember, that fall within your price band.

I could have mentioned Aurajo, Diamond Creek, Grace Family, Screaming Eagle and a few others, but those are out of scope.

BTW, I like your 1963 Port idea. If you can find a bottle of the Quinto do Noval it'd be a real treat! Also the 1994 Croft - but that's very different in style. The '63 Quinta is elegant, complex, supple, fully resolved, utterly gorgeous wine. The '94 Croft is a voluptuous, decadent, 44DD harlot of a wine that takes no prisoners. Take your pick. ;^D

Tom S

Shafer Hillside Select is truly nectar of the gods....

- John

Choke....spit...cough...gag...vomit....

Excellent! More for the rest of us. :^)

Tom S

The worst of the worst...undrinkable wines made by morons for idiots....

You might be surprised to know that many of those "morons" are Italian - and so are their supposedly "idiot" customers.

I feel sorry for you, huddled in your tiny little "Italian only" world.

I also love Italian wines (reds in particular) but the _real_ world is a much bigger place, and frequently at _least_ as interesting!

Tom S

idiots....

Italian - and

Do you work for Nicks, Nic... err.. Mat ... ? ;)

No.

If you'd been around here a bit longer you probably would have noted my mentioning Dan Murphys [

Dan's is good for mass produced bulk stuff, and occaisionaly some mid-range to premium stuff, and beer and spirits, but Nick's is a real old world type of merchant, rather than a mega conglomerate, sell em cheap and sell em by the truckload is the Dans business model.

He wants your business so he'll bend over backwards to help you out. And his prices are very close to Dan's. In fact the two things I've gone to the effort of price matching were *$2 [on a ~$15 bottle] and $3 [on a ~$30 bottle] cheaper* at Nicks.

And he guarantees everything in his shop. Which is in contrast to Dans who sell anything regardless of quality.

And I signed up for Dans mailing list. About 3 years ago. Emails to date: 0. Except for the reply to my inquiry as to why I hadn't recieved any email "We only send out emails occaisionally for special offers", very occaisionally apparently.

Sign up for Nick's mailing list. Its full of great wines and tasting notes etc. Its a joy to see it in the inbox.

If you get a chance go to the shop in Malvern. Its a tiny pokey little place, but the range there is magnificent. And he'll pop something open for you for tasting usually. He's a funny old character. Part of the charm of the place I think.

And the website is chockers with information and tasting notes etc. Its great.

As he said when I mentioned Dan Murphys "They might poke you after a couple of weeks of you being on the floor to see what the smell is, but apart from that they're not very helpful nor knowledgeable".

The sad part is Nick's is miles away, or I'd be there at least once a fortnight, if not more.

So, in short, no. :)

But you can tell I get a bit excited by Nick's. ;)

Gee, since you put it that way, the scales have fallen from my eyes! Surely, you must be the Ultimate Wine Guru.

I humbly prostate myself upon the altar of your wisedom. I am in awe of your excremence.

S moT

Sorry - no, i've only noticed the recent ref's to Nicks.

Yep, know Nicks well, subscribe & buy there, and went to the shop once when meeting some locals at their local Italian/pizza place. Actually, I wonder if they're all electronic now, as we used to get a printed newsletter in the mailbox too ... haven't seen one in a while ...

Used to live next door to Dan's in Alphington, and later on I lived and worked near Phil Murphy stores. Nicks nose best ;)

California Cabs? NEVER!

First of all, the CS is not a good food wine. Secondly, no wine made in California can approach the heights of Italian reds.

I'll forgive you. Just once.

They still have the printed newsletter in store [its just the printout of the email I think], which is really good, but I'm not sure if a mailout still occurs. The costs probably outweigh the benefits.

I'll be making a trip up there soon I think.

Um and they still handlabel the wines with old style sticky price tags. No scanning etc.

How would _you_ know? You have stated numerous times that you drink *only* Italian wines, and don't participate in wine tastings!

You are, therefore, ineligible to weigh in on this topic.

And you're dead wrong anyway. So THERE!

Tom S