TN: Gloria mini-vertical, meeting Mark S.

Oct 04, 2004 18 Replies

Friday was my 44th, and Betsy slaved in the kitchen, to prepare a nice meal for us and some friends. She had some assorted hors d'oeuvres out, and we started with some opened SB as well as the 2003 Basa Rueda. Again a crowd-pleaser, citric-tropical fruit with a pungent nose and a pleasant finish. B+



The previous night I had eaten at Beard House, and had mentioned (at 1 AM) to Betsy I hadn't tried one dish- in the garden a server never came my way with the spoons of carrot/mango/ginger soup. She found a recipe for carrot/mango soup, and adjusted it to add ginger. Now that's a wife! Excellent soup.



Next up was a chicken liver salad, over watercress and pickled shallots. The wine was the 1999 Droin Vaillons 1er Cru Chablis. Good acidity and clear mineral/stone notes, white stone fruit and some lemon, no oak showing, showing quite well- a surprising A- despite a so-so-vintage.



I had asked Betsy for a fairly simple backdrop for some Bordeaux, and she obliged with some delicious herbed chicken. Baked rice and green beans on the side. We did a little mini-vertical of Gloria (the '96 was alas corked):


1982 Ch. Gloria (St-Julien) Decanted immediately before the meal. This is a sentimental bottling for me, a dozen years ago it started my Bordeaux obsession. I may have liked it better a couple years ago, but this was actually hanging pretty tough. Some leathery blackcurrant and black plum fruit, aromas of cedar/cigarbox, herbs, and mushrooms. Time to drink up, with pleasure.B+/A-


1998 Ch. Gloria (St-Julien) Decanted couple hours before guests arrived. This was hard and a little green tasting at opening- not pleasant at all. By dinner time a better wine was showing - cassis with only the slightest hint of greenness, some oregano and graphite. Tannins apparent but under control. Not for the long haul, but could use a few more years to round out. B+


2001 Ch. Gloria (St-Julien) Soft and easy Gloria, ripe plum fruit. Balanced, without the structure of the '98. I'm going to aim towards drinking these in the fairly short term. B

There was also a 375 of 1996 Ch. Talbot (St-Julien) floating around. My second bottle from a recent acquistion. Black cherries and plums, ripe low-acid wine, some chewy tannins. My first bottle had a slightly worrisome roasted note to the plum fruit, but actually showed better on second day. This bottle didn't have the roasted note, some nice coffee notes layered on top of the fruit. B+



The leftover Chablis went well with some goat cheeses afterwards, while the reds tried to hold up to some Colston Basset Stilton (leftover from the Basset's birthday), port would've been better. Great night, great friends.



The following day started off with a lot of housework, vet visit, etc. But I made it over to Zachy's where I met Mark S. (poster here) and his wife visiting from Syracuse. We sampled some wines (insert usual store tasting caveats here): Big table of Australians. I skipped the Woop Woops and several others, but did try:



2002 Langmeil Shiraz- sweet, sweet, reminded me of the Marquis Philips. B-
2003 Kaesler Stonehorse GSM- good substitute for a bigger Côtes du Rhône (or a smaller CdP), though now at $15 (I paid $12 for last vintage), maybe pushing the value edge. B/B+
2001 Barton Vale Changling Shiraz- big, powerful, ripe. lots of oak. B
2002 Berry's Bridge Shiraz -huge, thick, just this side of syrupy. B-

The Bobby Kacher table:



2003 Domaine de Pouy - from ugni blanc. And it shows. No oak, but not much of anything else. C+
2003 Thomas "Clos de La Crele" Sancerre- nice flavors, but fat. Who needs fat Sancerre? B-
2003 Thibert-Parisse Macon-Prisse- again, a bit on low-acid side. B-
2003 Herve Seguin Pouilly-Fume- ok, not exactly zippy, but enough acidity to balance the ripe apple and fig fruit. B
2000 Campuget Costières du Nîmes Prestige - dense big wine for the money ($12.99), nice for style. B
2003 Mas de Guiot Granache/Syrah- clean no -oak wine, medium to full bodied, ripe red fruit, crowd-pleaser party wine at $8. B
2003 Fondreche Cotes du Ventoux - light nose, little tannic, a bit hot. B-
2000 Andre Brunel "Le Muret" Châteauneuf-du-Pape - ok CdP,red fruit and spice,but pushing the value envelope at $33. B

I invited Mark and his wife Ha to drop by (they were heading to Rochambeau, and driving right by our house). We sampled the leftovers from the night before- the '82 Gloria was really showing its age, and the '98 was holding up surprisingly well. The '01 seemed a bit flat on day 2. Mark brought in a bottle of the 2003 Dr. Konstantin Frank Dry Riesling. Really quite a nice wine, if not exactly totally dry. Ripe apple fruit, nice finish, B/B+ Very nice to put a face on a long-time Internet acquaintance.



Grade disclaimer: I'm a very easy grader, basically A is an excellent wine, B a good wine, C mediocre. Anything below C means I wouldn't drink at a party where it was only choice. Furthermore, I offer no promises of objectivity, accuracy, and certainly not of consistency Dale



Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply


Happy B-day, Dale (you young whippersnapper! ;-))

Nice tasting notes (per usual). The Campuget and Mas de Guiot are long-time house wines Chez Liptoneski. And you get all the luck with visitors, you dog. No one ever comes through Indiana :(

Mark Lipton

Hey Mark, next time I come through the Hoosier State, I'll be sure to give a ring. Of course, the last time was several years ago...For what it's worth, nobody likes Central New York either :(

Mark S

Happy Birthday.

Have you opened the 2000 recently? That's the only one I have, though haven't opened one yet.

Not recently. I have 6 sleeping. I had one right after release, thought it a fine example of a medium-bodied claret, not a bruiser that needs long-aging like some other mid-tier 2000 Bdx. Though I don't think this is a 25+ year wine, I prefer my wines with some age. As some (most?) 2000s are closed down now, I'm holding off for a while. If you open now, I'd suggest some decanting to give it a chance to awaken. Dale

Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply

As I avoided first (second, third and fourth) growth 2000's because of price, I wonder if any I have are really "long haul" wines.

Oh well, at least I have my vintage ports!

I'll let them sit for now.

I want to buy a 2003 Bordeaux for a belated wedding gift. At least I can afford to spend a little more because it's only one bottle. I'm still too cheap for the 300 dollar+ first growths.

Does anyone have a suggestion of a good midrange priced Bordeaux (2003) that will stand up to 20 years or so of storage?

Well, from the 5ths, I'd guess (with all the caveats mentioned in the aging thread) that Lynch Bages, Pontet-Canet, Grand Puy Lacoste, Dauzac,Clerc Milon will almost certainly do 20+, and Cantemerle or du Tertre might. Ditto cru bourg. like Sociando-Mallet, Chasse-Spleen, etc.

Dale

Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply

I have the 2000 Lynch Bages (1 bottle) and Grand Puy Lacoste (6 bottles). I wish I'd have bought more Lynch Bages, but I was miffed that I missed costo's 52 dollar bottles and had to pay $95.

But are you talking about the 2003's (for a wedding gift) too?

I haven't had any 2003 tastings. I think Michael Pronay did some barrel tastings? Dale

Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply

I think we're still at the point of buying futures for 2003. You're right, kinda hard to judge what we can't taste.

Maybe I'll wait till next year and see if they're still married!

Some of the bigger places around here get Bdx importers bringing barrel samples. By this time 2 years ago I had tasted some 2001s. But haven't seen any '03 samples yet. Barrell samples are of course pretty unreliable. Dale

Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply

Yes, I did. The usual suspects all did quite good, but here are my favourites offside the beaten track, all offering excellent QPR:

Bellevue (St-Emilion), Cos Labory, Dassault, Destieux, Faizeau, Fontenil (Dany Rolland's Fronsac property), Franc Mayne, Haut-Sarpe, Joanin-Bécot (Côtes de Castillon), Kirwan (excellent), La Couspaude (St-Emilion), La Gravière (Lalande de Pomerol), Langoa-Barton, Larmande, Lascombes (the best since the new regime), Le Gay (new ownership, Rolland consults), Phélan-Ségur (the best since 86/88), Rollan de By.

M.

Hi, Michael -

Thanks for that, but what about the 2003 Pavie? That's the wine that has inspired so much controversy IIRC. Have you tasted it yet? If so, what do you think?

Tom S

Excellent, as usual, but it did not blow me off my feet. I rated it 93 (tasted blind). Ausone probably is slightly better.

M.

I asked about the 2003 Pavie because of the apparent controversy over it. Parker loves it; Robinson _hates_ it. I'd like to know the reason for such disparity of opinion between two experts.

Tom S

Parker rates it very high (96-100, iirc), Robinson & Coates damn it, wrongly imnsho. You might use the search function of Mark Squires' Bulletin Board on eRobertParker.com - this has been discussed extensively.

M.

Thanks for the reference* Michael, but it was _your_ nsho I was most interested in. :^)

Could you please expand a little on why Coates & Robinson disparage the wine so strongly, and why you think they are incorrect in doing so?

Tom S

  • I'll look at this later.

| Pavie (StEm1er) Nougat and coco; firm texture with aromas of | dark fruit, beatiful sweetness, good tannins, enormous | potential. A wine that apparently polarises tasters like no | other - but I like it. | 93 (tasted blind with 20 other St-Emilions at Dassault) | | Pavie (StEm1er) Strange nose of wild cherries; swingeing tannins | on palate, needs air, then gets very classic. | 89 (tasted blind with 10 other St-Emilions at Clos Fourtet)

So the samples were not consistent, but for the benefit of the doubt I took the better one.

Jancis said it tasted like Port, but when she wants Port, she'd rather go to the Douro, not to St-Émilion. Clive more or less said that everybody liking this wine should have his brains checked. Btw, Broadbent is with them.

I have no idea where this prejudice against Pavie comes from.

M.

| Pavie (StEm1er) Nougat and coco; firm texture with aromas of | dark fruit, beatiful sweetness, good tannins, enormous | potential. A wine that apparently polarises tasters like no | other - but I like it. | 93 (tasted blind with 20 other St-Emilions at Dassault) | | Pavie (StEm1er) Strange nose of wild cherries; swingeing tannins | on palate, needs air, then gets very classic. | 89 (tasted blind with 10 other St-Emilions Premiers at Clos | Fourtet)

So the samples were not consistent, but for the benefit of the doubt I took the better one.

Jancis said it tasted like Port, but when she wants Port, she'd rather go to the Douro, not to St-Émilion. Clive more or less said that everybody liking this wine should have his brains checked. Btw, Broadbent is with them, although milder.

I have no idea where this prejudice against Pavie comes from.

M.

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