my wine wont start

I have just started out and on following the recipe below nothing is happenning, After adding the yeast the next day I added some yeast nutriant but still nothing, help. I am new so any advice welcome

thanks

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RIBENA WINE

Before I explain how easy it is to make wine with ribena let me point out that this famous syrup of excellent quality could well be added to fermenting 'musts' made up from of the fruits to get special results. The rate to add it would be one to two bottles per gallon.

When making wines from dried fruits the addition of one or two bottles of Ribena per gallon would make a vast improvement to the flavour and quality of the wine.

Similarly, when making wines from fresh fruits that give a red wine, one or two bottles or Ribena could well be added to make up for other fruits in this wy, you mar disregard the SO2 preservative (more about this later) because the amount in the Ribena will not be enough to stop fermentation, but it would be best to add it at the vigorous fermentation stage-during the first ten days.

If you propose to use Ribena in this way, bear in mid that each bottle contains approximately eight ounces of sugar, so you should reduce accordingly the amount of sugar in whichever recipes you are using.

Undiluted Ribena is not readily fermentable, because it contains just over seven pounds of sugar per gallon and is Preserved with 350 parts per million SO2-either of which is capable of preventing fermentation.

Obviously, our aim when making wine with Ribena will be to reduce the amount of sugar to about three and a half pounds per gallon, by using half Ribena and half water. In doing this, we shall reduce the SO2 preservative to around 175 parts per million. This amount is unlikely to prevent fermentation, though it could do so.

My trials with ribena were carried out with the above point borne in mind and it will be seen that I began with a good deal less than equal parts or Ribena and water, gradually bringing them up to equal parts.

Because I did not want to overwork the yeast by giving it too much sugar to work on at the start, and because I wanted to reduce the SO2 content to below 175 parts per million (without heating with the risk of spoiling the flavor of the syrup), I decided to work to the following method. The method, incidentally, met with the approval of V. L. S. Charley, B.BC., PH.D., technical director of the Royal Foresty factory of the Beecham group and one-time director of the Long Ashton Research Station, Bristol.

All water used in the process was first boiled and allowed tocool naturally.

STAGE 1: Two bottles of Ribena were diluted with twice the amount of water (four Ribena bottles full). Yeast in the form of a nucleus was added and the mixture allowed to ferment for ten days.

STAGE 2: After ten days' fermentation, two bottles of ribena and one Ribena bottle of water were added and the mixture allowed to ferment for a further ten days.

STAGE 3: After a total of twenty days' fermentation, two bottles of Ribena and one more bottle of water were added. Fermentation was then allowed to carry on to completion, taking, in all, three months. The result was a good, round wine flavored delightfully but not too strongly of fresh blackcurrants.

At stage 3 it was borne in mind that, while most of the SO2 would have been driven off during fermentation by adding those last two bottles, I was, in effect, bringing the total SO2 content up to 175 parts per million. fearing that the yeast might be just a little weakened at this stage I decided to drive off the SO2 in the last two bottles by raising the temperature of the to 70 deg. C. If you want to do this and have no suitable thermometer, stand the bottles in a saucepan of water and slowly raise the temperature until the Ribena in the bottles has increased in volume enough to reach the rims of the bottles. The temperature is high enough to drive off the SO2 and the heat should be cut off at once. The caps of the bottles must be removed before heating. The whole of fermentation was carried out in narrow-necked bottles plugged with cotton wool, fermentation locks being fitted after ten days. Racking was not carried out until one month after the last addition. Monthly racking followed until fermentation ceased. Even at this early stage the wine was nice to drink, but it had improved vastly at the age of six months.

At first it might seem expensive to make wine with Ribena, but against the cost one should set the fact that no sugar need be added and that one has a top-quality product all ready for the job in hand. Apart from this, there is no expensive fruit to buy, no messy crushing-in fact nothing much to do at all. And, most important of all, Ribena has been treated with a pectin-destroying enzyme, which means that you could boil it if you wished without fear of pectin clouding the finished wines. Such boiling would, of course, drive off the SO2 and give you a wine flavored slightly to cooked blackcurrants.

It will be seen that a sweeter wine may be made by using one bottle more of Ribena or one less of water, while a dry wine would result if less Ribena were used. A dry wine would lack the fuller flavour, but this would be offset to some extent by to dryness.

If eight bottles of Ribena are made into one gallon by adding water, the gallon will contain roughly four pounds of sugar and the equivalent of four pounds of blackcurrants. This amount of fruit is ample for a gallon of wine and, provided one likes a fairly sweet wine, this proportion of sugar to fruit is not too much. On the whole, I feel that seven bottles of Ribena would be the limit you could use to make a gallon of wine without it being too sweet.

It will be clear that my trials with Ribena, using six bottles to make just under a gallon of wine, have been most successful and I do urge readers to have a go.

A point to bear in mind is that a good light wine is often made with as little as two pounds of blackcurrants to the gallon, therefore, if you made four bottles of Ribena into a gallon of 'must', you would have used the equivalent of two pounds of blackcurrants and two pounds of sugar. This would give you a wine of about twelve percent of alcohol by volume. Such a wine would be dry, but by adding half a pound of sugar during the process you would get a sweeter wine of one or two percent more alcohol.

Reply to
Paul
Loading thread data ...

I am a newbie too. My advice to you would be to get a (double or tripple callibrated) hydrometer. That way you can judge how much sugar there is in your must and therefore how much alcohol it could potentially contain at the end of fermentation.

I would throw a guess in that it is either sulfite or very high sugar levels which are stopping the wine from starting properly. If you have a hydrometer reading, providing it to the group may also help them troubleshoot the wine.

Very best of luck, Jim

happenning, After adding the yeast the next day I

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

that this famous syrup of excellent quality

special results. The rate to add it would

Ribena per gallon would make a vast

two bottles or Ribena could well be added

(more about this later) because the

best to add it at the vigorous

contains approximately eight ounces of sugar,

seven pounds of sugar per gallon and is

preventing fermentation.

of sugar to about three and a half

shall reduce the SO2 preservative to around

it could do so.

it will be seen that I began with a

up to equal parts.

work on at the start, and because I

heating with the risk of spoiling the flavor

incidentally, met with the approval of V. L. S.

Beecham group and one-time director of

Ribena bottles full). Yeast in the form of a

water were added and the mixture allowed

more bottle of water were added.

months. The result was a good, round

driven off during fermentation by adding

175 parts per million. fearing that the

SO2 in the last two bottles by raising

suitable thermometer, stand the bottles in a

bottles has increased in volume enough to

SO2 and the heat should be cut off at

fermentation was carried out in

fitted after ten days. Racking was not

until fermentation ceased. Even at this

of six months.

cost one should set the fact that no sugar

hand. Apart from this, there is no

And, most important of all, Ribena has

it if you wished without fear of pectin

and give you a wine flavored slightly to

Ribena or one less of water, while a dry

flavour, but this would be offset to some

gallon will contain roughly four pounds of

is ample for a gallon of wine and,

not too much. On the whole, I feel that

wine without it being too sweet.

under a gallon of wine, have been most

little as two pounds of blackcurrants to the

you would have used the equivalent of

wine of about twelve percent of alcohol by

the process you would get a sweeter wine

Reply to
jim

I have just got a hydrometer and the reading I get is 1.100 please advise as to what this means, do I need to add more sugar or dilute it some

help

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reply to
Paul

Well as I say, I am no expert at all but the SpecificGravity (which can also equate to the total potential alcohol of the wine) sounds a shade on the high side. Saying that, if you used a montrachet red wine yeast (I believe it's pretty sugar tolerant but might not be able to turn that much sugar into alcohol. I think my montrachet can produce 15% under absolutely optimum conditions.) Perhaps this is the yeast used as your original recipe said that it would make a sweet wine.

Winemakers seem to suggest putting enough sugar in with the fruit to ferment to complete dryness at your desired alcohol level then adding sugar after that to make it as sweet as you want it. That way you can start with a less strong sugar level which may be kinder to the yeast...

My understanding is that a champagne style yeast (which can usually ferment up beyond 16%) would be a safer choice at that level of sugar pressuming you want to ferment the wine completely dry and then sweeten it. Otherwise a Montrachet style yeast may leave the wine a little less dry.

Have you gone 48 hours from adding the yeast yet? It could just be slow to get started. What temperature is the must at? I am sure one of the wine-heads will step in soon and give you some better answers.

Good luck!

Jim

what this means, do I need to add more

callibrated) hydrometer. That way you can

could potentially contain at the end of

which are stopping the wine from

group may also help them troubleshoot the

happenning, After adding the yeast the next day

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

that this famous syrup of excellent

to get special results. The rate to add

Ribena per gallon would make a vast

two bottles or Ribena could well be

preservative (more about this later) because

would be best to add it at the vigorous

contains approximately eight ounces of

recipes you are using.

seven pounds of sugar per gallon and is

preventing fermentation.

amount of sugar to about three and a half

shall reduce the SO2 preservative to

fermentation, though it could do so.

and it will be seen that I began with a

up to equal parts.

work on at the start, and because I

heating with the risk of spoiling the

incidentally, met with the approval of

factory of the Beecham group and one-time

Ribena bottles full). Yeast in the form of

of water were added and the mixture

more bottle of water were added.

three months. The result was a good, round

driven off during fermentation by

content up to 175 parts per million. fearing

drive off the SO2 in the last two bottles

have no suitable thermometer, stand the

Ribena in the bottles has increased in

enough to drive off the SO2 and the heat

heating. The whole of fermentation was

locks being fitted after ten days.

racking followed until fermentation

improved vastly at the age of six months.

cost one should set the fact that no

job in hand. Apart from this, there is

all. And, most important of all, Ribena

boil it if you wished without fear of

the SO2 and give you a wine flavored

Ribena or one less of water, while a

fuller flavour, but this would be offset

gallon will contain roughly four pounds of

fruit is ample for a gallon of wine and,

not too much. On the whole, I feel that

wine without it being too sweet.

under a gallon of wine, have been most

little as two pounds of blackcurrants to

'must', you would have used the

would give you a wine of about twelve

pound of sugar during the process you

Reply to
jim

1.100 is an excellent starting point. The SO2 might be the problem. Your best bet at this point is to quickly pitch a different yeast.

Greg

Reply to
greg

Ah yes, see my 'hydrometer isn't properly calibrated' post above for why it seemed a little high, heh heh.

Cheers for correcting that Greg.

Jim

Reply to
jim

Upon further consideration, several things have occurred to me.

First, this must be one heck of a sweet beverage if it must be thinned out before fermentation. Various sources online describe Ribena as a beverage, but your recipe describes it as a syrup. Are there different varieties of this product?

Second, and more relevant to your query, perhaps they have changed the formulation of it. Are you certain that it only contains SO2? Even a small amount of other preservatives would prevent fermentation. Look for "Sorbic acid" or "Sorbate" on the label. If you find either, I very much doubt you'll ever get the yeast started.

Regards,

Greg G.

Reply to
greg

Standard Ribena (concentrate rather than ready made) contains:

Water, Sugar, Glucose Fructose Syrup (from wheat and maize), Blackcurrant Juice from Concentrate (22%), Citric Acid, Vitamin C, Preservatives (Sodium Benzoate, Sodium Bisulphite), Colour (Anthocyanins)

Source:

formatting link

I hope this helps solve the issue,

Jim

Reply to
jim

I think the Benzoate might be a problem. I've never tried to ferment anything that included it as an ingredient, but most sources indicate that it will prevent fermentation. As an example, the following is from a recipe on Jack Keller's web site:

"A second complaint was that at least two people had trouble getting the must to begin fermentation. That problem, it turns out, was due to the products being heavily preserved with additives. If the additive is sulfite, we can solve it easy enough with a yeast starter solution and adding the syrup to it bit by bit, but if the problem is potassium sorbate or benzoate it will not ferment. Period. Read the labels carefully."

Regards,

Greg

Reply to
greg

Would boiling the ribena get rid of the preservatives I have bought 4 litres of the stuff and do not want to waste it

thanks

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reply to
Paul

I suspect Jim is correct... the Benzoate will persist no matter what. If you do somehow manage to get a fermentation started, I suspect that the must will rot before fermentation completes. It seems that the batch you've prepared might be a lost cause.

For the Ribena syrup that remains, you could start a batch of straight mead and use it for flavor and sweetening after fermentation is complete. That is, start a batch of plain mead following a dry mead recipe and at the first racking (at about the one month mark), top it up with Ribena. Allow it to age for another month or two, then rack again. Check the flavor and add Ribena and/or water as your palate dictates.

A little Ribena will probably go a long way being used like this. Is it any good on waffles? :-)

Greg

Reply to
greg

It's a bit too runny.

I think the preservatives used by the manufacturers must have changed fairly recently...

Jim

Reply to
jim

A search of this group on Google yields a number of threads on this subject. It seems that a slow starting and slow fermenting Ribena must is a common thing. It might be best to repitch yeast, if not already done, and let it go. It'll either ferment or rot. No reason to throw it out until you know for sure.

Here's a link to the past discussions:

formatting link

Greg G.

Reply to
greg

I wouldn't throw it out unless the cost is minor but the benzoate is going to be an issue. Maybe diluting it enough to get it to start and feeding the remaining in might be the best option. If you are concerned about spoilage you could take what you have now and freeze it in gallon bags; then thaw a gallon at a time to add it back in.

I might start like this.

Take 1/10 of what you have and dilute it with 5 to 10 parts water and enough sugar to get that to a SG of 1.070. See if that will ferment. If not, find another use for the remaining batch. Assuming it gets going, once you have a decent ferment add back into it the same amount of Ribena you started with and see what happens. Go slow and keep the fermentation temperature over 70 F.

I am making this up; I have no experience doing this by the way... That is what I would try if i were you though. You do have to be very careful of using anything with preservatives, they are in there to retard fermentation among other things but you know that now.

Joe

Reply to
Joe Sallustio

Jack Keller dealt with a very similar situation to this in a recent blog entry.

See

formatting link
Look for "Fermentation Troubles" under the December 10 entry. It essentially deals with making a very large starter colony of yeast to add to the must. If this doesn't reach the desired degree of fermentation, then add another starter colony when the first one stops.

minor but the benzoate is

Reply to
shbailey

DrinksForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.