need help improving quality

That's an excellent suggestion. Thanks!

With homebrewing I have found that RCB is a better resource than most forums because there's a lot more people contributing. Although you have to deal with a higher volume of pricks too. So I'll probably visit the forum, but get the bulk of my goodness from RCW.

Cheers, Scott

I was wondering the same thing but followed instructions on the kit. Hmm.. I suppose that's about the same instructions you find in homebrew kits that tell you to drink the beer two weeks after brewing. I like to cold condition my ales for 6 months! So... I think that's another great point you're making. Longer aging since these are reds, and maybe addition of wood.

Regarding wood addition. Would it make sense to get oak chips and them into a tertiary fermenter for long term aging?

Scott

As another newbie to winemaking, allow me to toss in my 2 cents worth:

My guru, who first started me on the path of wine making, gave to me these words of wisdom:

"When it comes to wine kits, you really do get what you pay for."

In other words price does matter. My first kit was on the very low end of the range - Argentia Pinot Grigio - I didn't want to spend a great deal of money on a kit until I got the hang of it. Now, due to a couple of what now I believe to be fortuitous accidents, I managed to stretch a

4 week wine kit into 3 months. The end result was not bad. Granted, as vin, it was pretty ordinaire, but drinkable. I really did not expect much more. like wise the Chianti from the same series. These two kits gave me the confidence to try something better.

I have gradually been moving up the ladder, and buying more expensive kits. I expect more from these kits than I did from the first. From what I gather from reading here and in in my local wine making supply shops, Selection International, while not bad, is not "great". From the literature I picked up in the brew shops, (every trip, I leave with whole sheaves of pamphlets)I would not expect as much from a Selection International (their lower end) as I would from the same company's Selection Estate, or Selection Limited Edition. However, I would expect more from the Selection International than I would the Argentia where I began.

Another person here wrote, and I quote, "you can spend $100 and get a good wine kit, or you can spend $150 and get a great one."

My advice: try another, better kit. I think you will be much more satisfied with the results.

Abby

I don't doubt that. I did deliberately buy a cheaper kit as my first experience. Just to get used to it. I don't know why, but I excpected it to be better. Even at the price of the most expensive kits out there, it's a heck of a lot cheaper than what we pay now. So if I can make wine as good as or better than what we buy now.. I will be extremely pleased. Money isn't the real motivator, but it does help.

My next kit is $120, and after that is $160. I already own them. I fully expected it would be like this, but after trying my first $60 kit.. I expected more but there are lots of reasons it could have not been good. Which is why I posted. If the majority of the reason is the kit I bought.. that's actually great news because that means making great wine is really easy even for a newbie and I can simply buy my way into good wine made at home.

Thanks. This is the sort of dialog I was hoping for. There are a few other great comments too that I hope to capture in my next round.

Scott

Everybody else is so I might as well put my 2 cents in as well. (I realize

2 cents is not what it use to be so ...)

I have never made a red wine kit that really impressed me. They just do not meet my expectations and that includes the high end kits. Now I understand that some kits now come with a pack of skins to be added. I have not tried those and would like to hear others opinions of them.

On the otherhand, I never really liked white wine until I tried some of the kits. Some of them are amazing. I make them on a regular basis now.

Then maybe should shold consider broadening your horizens a bit. Country fruit wines are not at all like the fruit wines you buy in the store. Home make to your specification of dryness can be amazing. For reds, berry wines and cherry wines made dry will amaze you. Much the character of a light red French wine rather than the heavy california wine. And then there are meads. Home made mead is astounding and does not compare to the mead you buy. I love a good dry blue berry or dewberry mead with just enough berries to hint at their existance without overpowering the honey character.

An interesting side issue with making your own wines, when you get away from kits, is that it will greatly broaden you understanding and appreciation of the variance in wine.

Just a few thoughts.

Ray

My Guru also said to me:

"Once you taste a good one, you won't want to drink the poor stuff any more"

Always remember, the poorer stuff can always wind up as cooking wine.

Somewhere out there, is a coq au vin with your name on it. :)

Abby

Technically you get most of the oak out of chips in a few days but I leave them in for months. Get the biggest chip you can find; some look like they came from a shredder and are somewhat stringy; I think they taste close to what they look like, sawdust. Don't boil them, a quick rinse is all they need. I use about an ounce per gallon which is on the high side, even for reds. I like medium to medium heavy toast; don't use untoasted.

Maybe take a few bottles and pull the corks and just add a few differing quantities and see what you think 2 weeks later.

Age is affected by temperature; keeping them at 70 to 75 may bring them around faster too. (That's not a good way to treat wines you want to take care of, but these may be more of an 'experiment' now so...)

I like RCB too; I make more wine than beer but it's a very active group.

Joe

At $160 you are probably in the range of making Brehm's from grapes; I'm pretty sure you will be very satisfied with the results from them but there is more work involved. You may want to find out where fresh produce comes into town wholesale and see if they ever bring in fresh grapes or pailed juice.

Joe

While on your road trip, swing down to Moab, Utah. Believe it or not, there is a winegrowing going on there and the winery we visited had some very nice wines.

Have you checked with the winery down on the south end of the Springs? Info is here

wineryID6. I don't know if the guy can help but he is fun to talk to. Does OK wih his wines also. I visit there whenever I get out to the Springs.

Hi Scott ! the thread was old when i read it...i live in boston where there's a relativly large immigrant community: Italian, Spanish, Portugese & more. we all go to the regional wholesale produce center ( all New England produce passes thru the Chelsea Produce Terminal on its way to restauarnts & markets) in september when california commercial varietals come in for us old schoolers to pick over.

I'd always suspected that there was a local winegrape outlet; i was stunned to learn that there were 4 seasonal, competitive dealers of cali varietals, fresh juices, cali & some imported, and quality equipment.

I'd bet that if you investigated a little, you'd find that there's a semi-local winegrape source in your regional produce center. I'd suggest going into a small, sucessful looking local fruit & veg stand and simply asking if they know where to get wine grapes, etc. If you're lucky, that person maybe a HWM himself!

the link that i've enclosed is an example of one of the 4 families who operate out of our produce center from september til thanksgiving-ish, 7 days a week, 5AM til sunset+ until the grapes/juices are sold out. i've got no stake in this except that we've bought grapes from the for 8 years. they're typical. HTH, regards, bobdrob

That is disheartening, We still have three feet of snow on the ground and have water mains nine feet down freezing...

A. J. The Anchorage Fishwrapper and Litterbox Liner Press

It's amazing that water lines are buried 9 feet deep. Here in Kansas 3 feet is sufficient to prevent freezing. Keep the faith A.J. Spring will come to Alaska too. I fear that the Chardonnay will get an April fool this week. Frost is predicted mid-week.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas USA

We need to go 3 feet to get below frost line in Pittsburgh too. We call it shovel height, if you are using a 'D' handled shovel it doubles as a good marker.

Joe

No, sorry, that was a comment on my practice. What I meant was that I'm planning to make a high end red wine kit every 2-3 years to see where the general quality is. For my taste, red kits don't compare to the wine I can make from grapes but if they get there, it would be a major bonus.

Pp

That's good... not much at all. How long did you let this batch age? I've found that it generally doesn't get too good until it's been aging for over a year.

Scott, If you'd like to try the higher end kits or would like more information on what kits seem to be the most popular, take a look at

The Discussion Forum is very helpful, friendly, and well moderated. I've ordered kits from them before and I'm very happy with the service provided by the owners. Good luck!

When I made this comment it aged for 3 months. I forgot my reasoning for this but it came from the kit's instructions. If I recall correctly, it's due to the kit's preservatives. There wasn't enough for long term aging and I think it said that was the longest you should let it age unless you added more preservatives.

Enough preservatives or not my wife and I don't enjoy drinking it so I'll let it age a lot longer. If it's not good I'll dump it, if it is good.. awesome.

Thanks for the feedback. I appreciate it.

Scott