Can Black Tea Just Be Black Tea?

What is wrong with "Chinese black tea"?

I wouldn't use dark either.

The only somewhat fitting synonym I find is 'sable'. According to wikipedia it is 'Archaic or literary English for black' and also the color black in heraldry.

The only other possibility I can think of is not to use a color, but something along the line of 'aged tea'. But then it may be misinterpreted as old and stale tea.

Greetings, Stefan

For post-fermented tea ? Brown tea. Let them use western naming according to the colour of the liquor. If they don't want to adopt western naming, just let them struggle with naming in western market. Simple as that.

P.S. Expecting flames by Chinese...

Why not call it red tea since we dont use the term. You think we will know the difference from a black. The infusion is more bloody red than any English black blend can make. The puer groups say ripe or cooked just as often as shu but consistently use sheng. I attend Puer tastings once a month. We consistently use the term fermented for shu,liuan,liubao,jupu because it sounds so healthy.

Jim

Well, I'll give them sable, and see what they think. I also suggested post-fermented. You're right about aged. They don't want a name with a negative connotation. That's why they didn't like "dark".

Brown tea ... I'll see how that goes. How about Grey tea?

As for naming in the western market, there is also the option to reclaim the name "black tea". But let's see how that goes.

I think "post-fermented" has the advantages of being accurate and unambiguous. Using color terms in English will always leave doubt about what exactly you're talking about. Regarding "aged", not all post-fermented teas are stored until they're old.

/Lew

I dont know why we couldnt change WoDui to 'woody'. Ive seen that used several times to describe the taste. I would say Ottawa Heap but some would say that disparages our neighbor to the North.

Jim

That's exactly right, I tried several synonyms for black and re- translated them to Chinese - and none of them really worked. In Chinese there are lots of synonyms for black that will work perfectly well, however.

Also very true.

One person suggested since the word tea is borrowed from Chinese into English, why not borrow the word "hei" to mean black. Then 黑茶 could become: Hei cha or Hei tea

How about it?

Just to offer my opinion, stick with "Black Tea" or "Chinese Black Tea" I have read all the suggestions, and the only one I would consider would be "sable" but the average American non-connesiuer will have no idea nor care about fancy or esoteric names like "post- fermented" many people don't even know that tea goes through a fermentation process and fermentation is seen negatively here. We don't advertise foods with the word fermented like in other countries so you wouldn't want to use it in a food/drink context here.

While "black" may not be the best work for the Chinese, it is the perfect and one of the longest held American tea terms. I've had to explain hundreds of times that "Orange Pekoe" does not contain orange (the fruit) as many here believe it indicates. Simple is best.

- Dominic

Ah... but that is precisely the problem. Perhaps I should have worded the question better: Can Red Tea be Black Tea?

In Chinese, what we call "black tea" in the west is called "red tea" or "hong cha" ºì²衣 But in Chinese, there is also the tea category "black tea" or "hei cha" ºڲ衣So because ¡°red tea" has been so long known as "black tea" in the West, what are Chinese to do to translate the term "hei cha" meaning black tea into English, when that word is already taken over by another tea category. This is the problem right now.

You have a good point there. Mention "food processing" and "China" in the same sentence and it raises up all kinds of flags and alarm bells. Scrap post-fermented then, I guess.

Here's the link in Chinese to the article that prompted this discussion in the first place:

I suppose the question they really want to know, is what are all you cool tea peeps/tea connoisseurs willing to accept as the English for "hei cha".

Proposed suggestions include:

1. hei cha
2. dark tea
3. fu tea (note: a new name meaning "happiness")
4. return to original, direct chinese tranlation: black tea
5. don't know/care

So is the goal here to get uninformed people excited about something they can be persuaded to swallow only until they learn what it really is? I hope not, because there are lots of things in life I find more interesting.

On second thought, if there's little regard for truth, then we could get really creative. How about Immortality Tea? Virility Tea? Wealth Tea? Oral Roberts's Oriental Secret? (Dead people can't sue, can they?)

/Lew

Nothing wrong with post-fermentation per se, except when you actually have to explain the term precisely and what's involved, I'm just saying, that might put people off in the West. The tea might be totally safe and of excellent quality, but I think people would think it's unsafe, if you make things too complicated.

I'm not saying hide the truth, I'm thinking about the name, and what people might associate the tea with.

Honestly, I say you should use the term "Hei Cha" as-is in such cases. It's better than some made up name, and has history and tradition. Otherwise stick to Black Tea or if necessary begin to use Red Tea in cases where it fits. I just know that "Red Tea" might conjure images of Rooibos, or some other type of tisane. People have access to the Internet and if they are interested they will look into it. I know a few people who have bought a box of Pu-Erh teabags from the grocery shelf but then came to me when they didn't like it and wanted to know if I knew of it... when I ask why they bought it, almost invariably they say "it sounded exotic."

- Dominic

Ok, does everyone agree on "Hei Cha"?

Youre back to square one. It wont be lost on some unscrupulous vendor hei cha means black tea in Chinese. That is the stuff he sells at a cheaper price. Im more of a fermented fan dropping the post. Some consumer will wonder about pre fermentation. You cant really say it is mao cha. If that consumer ever wonders what happens to sheng over the long hall tell them it matures or ages.

Jim

It's OK by me. It doesn't distort reality, and, while it's opaque to most Westerners, so was Oolong alias Wulong once upon a time.

/Lew