Pu-erh storage and shipping

hmm, never heard of storing food and clothes on the same shelf, but whatever makes your monkey jump. I wouldn't worry all that much man. Pu has such a.. er.. robust taste that it would take a lot to contaminate it. If your clothes are all smelly though then that might do it.

I wouldn't worry about the mix and match. Make sure the vendor puts in packing material so the contents don't joust against each other. Substitute paper bags for plastic. I go with SAL from China which is

Jim

oleg shteynbuk wrote:

Mixing multiple types of puerh in one box for shipping is not a problem.

Wrapping the puerh in plastic during shipping is not a problem either as long as the tea is thoroughly dry. Allowing the tea to breath is an aging requirement and the tea will not age enough during shipment to be of any concern. I would however recommend leaving the bags open so moisture is not trapped inside of the baggies as I have seen very fresh and still somewhat moist bricks mold when shipping in a sealed plastic bag. I have asked one of my vendors to use baggies in order to prevent damage to the wrappers but I asked him to punch several holes in the baggies first. In Hong Kong and Taiwan they often shrink wrap the cakes using a perforated shrink wrap which still allows the tea to breath but prevents damage to the delicate paper wrappers.

Shipping rates are dramatically cheaper when shipping by Surface versus using other methods. Here are some examples based on a 3kg package via China Post from Kunming to the USA.. AIR: $54.64 SAL: $33.25 SURFACE: $19.78 So Surface is 40% cheaper than SAL, and 64% cheaper than AIR.

Keeping you long term stash in your closet is acceptable as long as your cloths dont have any odor to them, like fabric softeners etc. Contamination from strange odors is one of the largest problems encountered when trying to age puerh in the average American Home. The worst place to keep your stash is in your kitchen, which all too often is where people tend keep their tea.

I strongly suspect that the tea they chopped up and used as currency a couple thousand years ago is not the connoisseur grade tea that we strive for today.

Mike

Jim,

Thanks, I got quote from vendor that SAL is about 4 weeks to arrive and Surface is about 8 weeks to arrive to NY and and no mention of Air and if it is only $2 more I would take it.

Oleg

Space Cowboy wrote:

Mike, thanks, I actually use

Detergents, fabric softeners, dry cleaners they all have some sort of smell that you don't want in tea. Is it OK to keep puerh on the open book shelf as long as there is no direct sunlight maybe in carton package; or better to put into chest of drawers and each type of pu-erh into separate drawer?

Oleg

Mike Petro wrote:

Shipping is always a added charge. You won't know how much shipping costs till you get the first parcel and see the actual shipping charge. Sometimes part of the shipping cost is buried in the selling price. Heretofore all my shipping is from the interior Kunming and all the vendors charge actual shipping cost of about $12/kilo/SAL. In this case this is a new vendor with shipping from Shanghai. Since it is a major shipping port I think that is the reason the added cost of AIR versus SAL is so cheap. Or maybe hidden shipping cost but anyway I'll pay for the AIR. SAL or SURFACE from China is a function of catching the slow boat from China if it is in port or possibly dry dock. I had one SAL from Kunming in 20 days and one late as 40. You should be able to get a quote for AIR. They take the parcel to China Post, check the appropriate shipping method and pay the cost. When I discover I am paying actual shipping cost then I have various single kilo parcels spaced out over time in the pipeline.

Jim

oleg shteynbuk wrote:

An open bookshelf would be fine in a room wiothout strange odors. For example no cigarette smoke, no pungent cooking fumes, so strong air fresheners etc. Yes, do protect from sunlight.

I use a filing cabinet, an old (odor free) Foot Locker, some wooden cabinets in my Den, etc. One friend of mine uses a wicker laundry basket stuck in the corner of a spare bedroom. Really you dont have to get very particular about it. Just avoid strong oders, sunlight, and make sure it can get some air. Usually if the climate is comforatable enough for humans it will be fine for Puerh.

Mike

I was planning on getting around 3kg, but you mention that it is better to keep under 2 kq; what is the main reason for this like in case the package lost - not such a big damage, or condition of packaging? I can make it into two packages.

Also shipping cost is probably based on the total package weight not on the tea weight as it mention on the vendor website, how much could the packaging take - probably no more than 25% so if i want to pay shipping cost under 2 kg tea weight should be 1.5 and for under 3 kg maybe 2.25 kg ?

Thanks,

Oleg

Space Cowboy wrote:

What I did is this:

I went to the local home improvement / gardening store and got some of those red clay 14 inch stubby flower pots - the short ones, not the regular ones - with the corresponding size dish underneath - except the dish goes on top in my case. This was in the middle of the hot summer, when they have lots of inventory there, but also what I did was I gave the flower pots a good washing with some non-toxic health-food-store-type dishwashing detergent - unscented, or very nearly close to it - and then I set them out into the hot sun to dry thoroughly for a day or two. I also inspected them closely before I bought them to make sure they weren't moldy or smelled bad or left over from last year, etc...

Then, I went to the local fabric store, and picked out some nice patterns in 100% cotton - 2 yards - the normal width works perfectly for the 14 inch flower pots. I washed the fabric in fragrance-free laundry detergent and then line dried it.

Then I fold the fabric over in half, the long way - I bought 2 yards, I make that effectively 1 yard now - I put the 14 inch pot in the middle, bring the two cut ends and the one folded end together where they don't quite reach, put the dish on top, and then fold the other two ends over to cover up the dish.

I tried this just as an experiment, but the 14 inch stubby flower pot and two yards of cloth seem to be made for one another. I figure that as long as the flower pots are fresh inventory and haven't been sitting around and molding, and if the cloth is 100% cotton, it's a winning combination. It's a good size for beeng chas, and I put the tuo chas on the bottom. But there are probably lots of ways to arrange the tea.

Overall, the cost was around $8 for the pot and dish, and the fabric that depends on how nice you want it, but under $10 shouldn't be a problem on that either. I'm happy with it. If you get nice fabric and keep it folded neatly you can put it on your bookshelf or whatever and it doesn't look all that bad.

I have a place available near subwoofer that can fit the requirements; hopefully low frequency will help aging :) Read some time ago about experiments with different type of music on crop growing. Will report results to the group in 20 years, if anything will be left, not sure if I can just look at puerh and smell it for 20 years and not to chip away some small pieces once in a several months to test the progress, hopefully it is ok and will not ruin cakes ecosystem.

Thanks,

Oleg

Mike Petro wrote:

A one kilo shipment seems to be the threshold where you are charged actual shipping cost versus purchase price shipping adjustments. I like spacing out a kilo shipment because it allows to me to catch up with contents before the next one. I'd rather receive mutliple single kilo shipments over time versus all at once. The other thing I like about a kilo box it fits on my shelving. The box also becomes my storage bin. It is a standard size used by various vendors. You pay for the gross weight of the parcel. I think there would be less additional packaging material total in smaller boxing than one big one but I think the difference isn't enough to worry about. The total surface area of multiple smaller versus larger would be the same. For an approximation the tea weight will be 1kg and gross weight 1.2kg. The packaging will take a beating and I think customs is more interested in larger parcels than smaller. All my early larger 1kg+ parcels seemed to have been opened and riffed. I think eventually your address is put in a customs database and subsequent shipments are cleared in transit.

Jim

oleg shteynbuk wrote:

...I delete me and you...

Always try to negotiate to pay ACTUAL shipping costs. Limiting yourself to 1 kg packages is the MOST expensive way to ship if you are paying actual China Post rates. The reason is that the FIRST kg is more expensive than subsequent kgs. The following examples come directly from China Post shipping tables:

to ship 5kg of tea

Surface:

SAL:

Air:

Having hosted several large co-op style purchases I have researched shipping from China extensively. It all boils down to the bottom line of $/kg based on the total weight of the shipment. The most cost effective method is Surface shipping by a long shot, and the heavier the box the less you pay per kg. The trade off is that you will typically wait 45-75 days for your shipment.

If you are confident in your vendor, and confident in your choices I would recommend placing the largest order possible by SURFACE shipping.

If you are unsure of your choices, or your vendors, I would recommend that you ask your vendor to send you 25g samples of each tea you are interested in by Air Mail. China has cheap airmail rates for things that will fit in a standard business envelope. Get a few different samples this way in order to gain confidence in your vendor/tea. Then place a larger order as above. If your vendor wont supply small samples find another vendor, there are others who will.

Mike

Mike Petro

There is no price break in China Post SAL kilo shipments from Kunming. My shipments vary from 1-2.5kg. The heaviest 2.5kg/210y while the lightest 1.2kg/110y with everything else proportional in between which is 10 shipments so far. The various shipping weights are distributed and not clustered. The number 1kg/100y from Kunming seems to be a good estimate to where I live in the US. There may be some break but not before 2.5kg. You need to look at the postage on your shipments. I also don't expect the same rates from Shanghai which remains to be seen. The actual shipping cost is a function of shipping distance, location and connections. You don't know till you see the package.

Jim

Mike Petro wrote:

Jim, with all due respect, you are mistaken!

I have personally received over 200kg of puerh directly from China in

The price break occurs at ">=1kg" gross weight, while the discount percentage may be different, the breaking point is consistently at the ">=1kg" point across all three shipping methods.

Furthermore, it does NOT matter where you live in the USA, the price is the same regardless if you are in California or Maine (not sure about PR, AK, or HI). However I have seen small differences due to surcharges based on "City of Origin". In other words Guangzhou might be a little different, not much, than Kunming. I have yet to find an online publication of these surcharges.

Jim, I did my homework on this one, but don't take my word for it, prove it to yourself by looking it up directly on China Post's own website. This is a link to the actual SAL shipping table

If you are paying ACTUAL shipping rates, shipping

Case reopened. I wished you would quote some SAL rates from your China Post shipping manifest/customs declaration forms from Kunming. It doesn't get anymore actual than that. We can judge for ourselves if there is a kg savings and if the costs are not the same then shipping location does matter and not a flat rate from anywhere in China to anywhere in the US. Here are some of mine from Kunming: 3168g/265y,

Jim

Mike Petro wrote:

Whatever Jim, as usual it appears that you like to argue with anything I say simply because it was me who said it.

Yes, I get those maifests too, only none quite that small, no I dont save them, and no I wont argue with you about this anymore. If you wont believe China Post's own published rates then there is little more anyone can say to you.

Mike

Mike snipped-for-privacy@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com1/9/06

Mike, not to open a can of worms, but I have a question: Would the China Post rates to us be the same from every area of China? Would the rates from Kunming be different from the rates from Shanghai or Guangzhou? Just asking.

Michael

You don't know what anything from Kunming costs. I do. I keep the manifest for provenance or in this case to verify I don't know what China Post is quoting. I don't care. I know parts of Yunnan are Autonomous if not the entire province. Maybe that makes a difference in costs from Kunming. Maybe it is the clerk charging more and pocketing the difference. Maybe their computers haven't downloaded the new rate tables. Maybe, maybe, maybe doesn't change the actual cost to my house. So suck it up and don't blame me.

Jim

Mike Petro wrote:

Yes Michael they can be different, thats what I meant when I talked about surcharges based on "City of Origin". There is no difference based on destination, USA is USA as far they are concerned, the only differences are based on "City of Origin".

The other thing to consider, although Jim obviousley hasnt, is that China Post offers discounts based on shipping volume, much like UPS does here. In other words if you ship more than X in a month you will get X discount, if you ship more than Y in a month then you will get Y discount etc. Several vendors I have worked told me of getting qualified for these discounts. That is probably why he had a few BOLs that were below the published rates. Howvever until you get the first quote from a vendor you cant count on them being qualified for the discount, so I always use their published rate as that is the worst case scenerio.

Mike