Ice Cider ?

Cidre de Glace. Made in Quebec, by a process analogous to Eiswein.

Interesting, even intriguing, but does not come close to the complexity of an ice wine.

Mike

In the early history of the US, hard (alcohol containing, fermented apple juice) cider sometimes was allowed to freeze in extremely cold weather in the NE part of the country. The ice was separated from the liquid. This removed much water from the cider and resulted in a drink much higher in alcohol as well as extract. This required quite low temperatures, because both alcohol and any residual sugar greatly lower the freezing point of the liquid.

Oh, please. Like you can have any of your tastebuds functional after the extreme sugar hit of an icewine. Those things run at a brix level of around 36-46. Sugar cane juice averages less than 20 brix. You can go into sugar shock just sniffing the stuff.

Not a fan of eiswein...

El Capitan

El Capitan says,

I think that's why icewein, and other very sweet, late-harvest wines, and 6 puttonyos Tokaji, are called dessert wines, and served up in small quantities. They are an appetite-suppressing, palate demolishing, after-dinner ritual.

To each his/her own tastes, but I find that a truly great dessert wine can be almost a religious experience. The aromas and flavors, depending on the wine, can range from honey to apricots to (in the case of riesling) apple blossoms. The rich textures can also be very exciting.

When one considers how hard these wines are to make, and their scarcity, it adds to the mystery.

Also, many of these wines are cellared for years before consuming them. I personally have lost interest in cellaring dry table wines, prefering to drink them young, but a fine old Sauternes can be an amazing experience.

Cheers,

---Bob

Salut/Hi El Capitan,

le/on Sat, 18 Oct 2003 18:49:25 -0500, tu disais/you said:-

From what you say here, El, you've never had a top class Eiswein. At a recent exhibition of world class sweet wines (last summer - thanks Michael P) Iniskillin were showing their ice wines, next door to Ch Yquem btw. How to put this......? Let's say that the balance left something to be desired, when compared even to other eisweins tasted during the week.

So what? If the fruit and acidity are in harmony with the sugar the wine never tastes cloying.

Again, so what? Firstly sugar cane juice isn't particularly sweet, and it is totally (ahem) without any acidity. You might as well criticise beef because you don't like lentils. Both contain lots of protein!

I have to admit that although I feel you've been unjust on eiswein, I don't regard it as the summum of achievement in sweet wines. In fact I'm at something of a loss to explain to myself why they seem to be a major topic of conversation so often. I guess it must be some kind of fascination with price. They're expensive, sure - mainly because they're extremely rare. Personally, I don't think their price is concommitant with their quality, which is no better (IMO) in terms of balance, depth and length of flavour than an average trockenbeerenauslese. A top trock, a top Tokaji Aszu beat them into a cocked hat for balance and above all for subtlety, while a top Sauternes or Monbazillac has the edge for refinement.

I had the pleasure of a wine tour of the Niagara region last year. Visited Inniskillin, Marynissen Estates, and others. Sampled the ice wines at several, and came to the inescapable conclusion that I truly don't like the stuff. I've tried a couple of dessert wines from Randall Graham's Bonny Doon stables, and a Tokaji here and there. Try as hard as I might, I've got an upper limit on sweet liquids I can enjoy, and ice wine, anything botrytized, and most dessert liqueurs are way above the limit. I don't even care for champagne doux. The Brut-er the Better.

I was being mostly tongue in cheek about all your tastebuds shutting down, but you knew that already...

Ah, the ol' lemonade argument. You've got a point, but I would have to make my lemonade with supersaturated sugar solution instead just tossing in a half-cup to reach the same sweetness levels in dessert & ice wines.

Just like I can compare fruitcake and fudge as suitable holiday treats. Doesn't change the fact that to my taste, fudge is great, the other totally nasty. De gustibus non est disputandum and all that.

EC

Bonny Doon...? And what Tokaji? I understand well if you stick to the brut(e)s - but I'd believe that there exist quite some great and expnsive sweet wines that just might change your mindset. :-) Anders

The human response to taste can vary greatly from person to person. The most extreme example I have seen was a chemical engineer where I worked many years ago. He did not like anything that was sweet. He would eat lemons. His children called him "old sour tooth". He refused sweet wine, cookies, cakes, and everything else that was sweet. If I had offered him

59 Yquem to taste, he probably would have remarked: You actually paid money for that swill?. On the other hand, I had a younger brother who could not get enough sweet food at about four years old. He would drink chocolate syrup and other very sweet liquids, and my mother had to hide these from him.