Introduction

Ben Snyder wrote in news:Y8Odna7jqr- ewnLZnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@adelphia.com:

Only had one Chard which I enjoyed, but it

So Ben, from Vermont . .. B in l not named Jerry I trust. What was the Chard you liked? Things like that make knowing your palate much easier. Don't worry about the Rose it will probably have more fruit than most whites so you can always say, "Be happy, it could have been a pinot gris!"

Hello Ben,

Be you welcome. Grab a chair and call the cat a bastard. Never mind alligator. Did you bring some chocolates?

Seriously, no doubt you'll fit in very well. I am personally a great fan of Alsace Gwz, even though these days I drink more Pinot Gris.

Cheers

Nils GUstaF

Welcome, Ben. When you get around to notes tell us about any good VT cheese you run across, too. :)

Ed Rasimus wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

Uhh, would that not be a Berger Belgique to which you refer?

I need to look in my notes to find the Chard. I believe it may have been the Simi Reserve. It was from California, not overly buttery. Not as sharp? as a French unoaked, though it wasn't dominated by vanilla. Quite crisp with a very pronounced nose of mainly apple, granny smith or similar green/yellow apple. Very slight biscuit/toast note in the nose but not detectable on the palate. Bold flavor though, more than I come to expect from a white. Funny thing, most notes on this chard indicate peach, though I didn't detect any.

Definitely will. I used to try staying away from local cheese and trying more exotic things, but always come back to the old standard sharp cheddars. The absolute best so far is this three-year aged cheddar from Cabot. The only places I've seen it is from a local meat market, but probably available in other places as well.

Manchego and erhaki are my favorite cheese overall, though sharp cheddar is now my favorite with almost any type of wine.

-ben

"Joseph Coulter" skrev i meddelandet news:Xns982C74DA01612yourvacationcomcastn@216.196.97.136...

THis is a spin-off from previous belligerence in the Old Mother COntinent (=Europe) - calling the shepherd Alsatian rather than German - slightly like calling Missy Queeny's family Mountbatten rather than Battenberg. No worries[1], today we are all good EU-citizens, including the Alsatian doggies.

Cheers

Nils Gustaf

[1] I am reallly really getting into the atmosphere for this Oz voyage, and no mistake, but you drongos all noticed. She'll be right.

Berger Belge? Actually it is called a Malinois (from Malines, the belgian city AKA Mechelen).

Typical Americans. They think that 'tasting' is the way to learn about wine. Stop the tasting and start drinking them, with food. Do not 'evaluate' the wines. Drink them and enjoy them. Note which ones you liked best, and do nothing else. Do not 'over-think' this. Do you make 'tasting notes' of every chicken you eat?

Damn!

Well put.

But the answer is yes, after a fashion. Certainly the chef of the house does (and for that I'm grateful!). When cooking, one needs to select herbs, spices, sauce ingredients, accompaniments... and all these things interplay into each other to make one meal memorable and another one so-so. The next time you're going to prepare chicken, do you poke around your spice cabinet at random? I don't, neither does my wife. We know what works well together, and what works better with lamb instead.

She makes "tasting notes" for chicken (etc) and has compiled a rather extensive (and wonderful) handwritten cookbook, which I continually benefit from. She also is very good at remembering stuff, and at identifying the sources of flavors when we go out to eat, so she can duplicate and improve upon what she's already had.

I see no difference between this and keeping notes of what wines you liked with what foods, and why. It's the "why" part that will lead you to new combinations that will work nicely, and help you avoid the ones that probably won't. And since, as my choir director is fond of saying, "elephants have memories, people have pencils", tasting notes can be quite useful in that regard.

Tasting notes are especially useful if you are laying away a case or two of something for a few years, because in a few years you'll forget what kind of food it goes best with. It is less useful if this is the only bottle of whatever is is you're drinking, and you're not going to be able to get another even if you liked it.

Sharing tasting notes is also a good way to introduce others to wines you liked (or didn't) and why, and what it is likely to go with.

I used to think that this business of "what wine goes with what food" was overblown poppycock, until one day when I had one of my favorite whites (I forget which) and was quite disappointed in it. I forget what I was having with it but there were several items. I took out the wine reccomendation list from Telluride Restaurant in Stamford (my first source and a favorite restaurant), and sure enough, I had some "food foes" of this wine on the plate, and some "food friendly" choices too. So, I took the opportunity to taste the wine with each of the courses.

It made a world of difference. I was blown away. With one of the foods, the wine was restored to its former glory. With another of them, it was rendered bland and uninteresting - and it was the same wine from the same glass.

Alas, I did not take notes.

I thought I remembered pine nuts and a sauvignon blanc were part of the deal, but my Telluride listing does not show that combination, so that wasn't it. And now I'll never know (and will be unable to share).

But, do try it with other foods. Go to

and pick out a wine, and have it with some "food friendly" foods and some "food foes" at the same time, and compare.

Keep notes. :) (ps - it works for Italian wines too)

Jose

Is there such a thing as a 'typical American?' If so, please enlighten me. I am absolutely tired of Americans being bashed because of prejudices against us by people of other cultures.

I do make tasting notes of particularly complex dishes that I make, yes. The purpose is so that I can repeat the experience. Simple fare like hamburgers, of course not. Key points are complexity and expense - if a wine is expensive then I will take good notes so I can either avoid or purchase what I like in the future. Not taking notes can lead to poor choices, and wasted money. As I get better at knowing my likes and dislikes, my notes get shorter.

-ben

Ben, Welcome to alt.food.wine! Unfortunately, you've also met our resident contrarian, Mr. Michael Scarpitti (aka UC). He is an American, but for reasons best known only to himself has set himself on a Quixotic crusade against decanting wine, tasting wine and (God forbid!) drinking wines not made in Italy. Pay him no more attention than you feel is warranted. Some afw contributors have decided that the effort isn't worth the payoff and so ignore him. YMMV.

Entirely reasonable, Ben. Like others here, I typically drink my wine with meals, but still want to note down what the wine is like, how well it pairs with the food and how much more life it may have (in the case where I have more of it). The beauty of wine is that it's a lifelong learning experience, and most of us greatly enjoy the homework! ;-)

Mark Lipton

Thanks for the welcome, great to be here.

Absolutely! I do love this sort of homework.

-ben

I am American by birth, Italian by ancestry. The typical American way of doing everything disgusts me, especially with regard to wine. The behaviour described in the original post is preposterous for a European. Drinking wine is not a scientific enterprise. It should not be approached as such. The case of the brother-in-law who saw "Sideways" and now thinks he needs to avoid Merlot and drink Pinot Noir (how original) is just too hilarious to believe. He needs to get a life. I did not need to see "Sideways" to enlighten me that Merlot was not the be-all and end-all in wine. The problem is that to go beyond 'beginner' one does not have to imitate professionals and engage in 'tasting', which is something that pros who buy and sell wine do. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever for consumers to 'taste' wine in the manner of the pros. The reason is that they don't have the qualifications or experience to do so.

That is not 'tasting'; that is drinking with food.

Oh for goodness sake Michael, take a pill !!!!!

"Michael Scarpitti" - the Columbus Clown wrote .....

^^^^^^^^^^^

Many of us could totally agree ..... Drive on wrong side of road Can't speak or write English for shit..... Bunch of Christian fundamentalist warmongers A host of other bullshit generalisations which would be as relevant as a cricket player in Azerbaijan!

The OP is American - just like you!

He *is not* a beginner; he *is not* European!

Unlike you, however, he has an inquiring mind - he wants to learn.

He wants to further his experience - you are a narrow minded idiot.

Game Over !!!!!

Oh, and welcome Ben . By and large, this is a great NG.

Thanks everyone for the welcome and info. This thread's going to get buried so I'm hopping off now...

Oh yeah, thanks to UC also. He's fun to play with. I imagine he's this cranky, self-referential expert in all matters. But at least he pipes up and says what's on his mind, rude or not. I have to respect that, in a way.

-ben

Ben Snyder wrote:

--snip--

yeah, it was pretty funny so i posted it.

i don't remember posting that i taste 'in the manner of pros'. next time i open a bottle, i'll be sure to not taste it at all.

'Taste' means to sip, swill around in the mouth, and spit out, not simply to swallow with food.

Ben, I attnend some wine dinners occationally in my area. It can be amazing how wines can influence foods but more likely how foods influence wines.

Also, I have noticed that a French Bordeaux or Burgandy has a hard tome following the more fruity California wines. So order of serving does make a differnece and what it is served with.

Finally UC makes many a good point in this group and is a contributor. You may or may not like what he posts but he does speak his mind. I think from looking at his posts over the months there is a common thread in them. You don't have to be a snob to enjoy wine. Wine is for enjoyment. Don't get stressed out by it. I tend to agree with him on that. You will find postings here on the most expensive wine have you bought, currently own in value etc. UC is correct that wine does not have to be about snobbery.

Hope you enjoy the group.