GBBF 2008

Not knowing many people? You know us - and we know most people. You probably already know Lynda and Stuart - they work there for setup and take down. Also Dougie and Lynda Smith. I'm sure Lynda would love to have you on Champion Beer of Britain! Oh and we'd love to see Phil if he comes. Anyway I'm sure you'd have a whale of a time!

In article , Christine writes

I never get to go coz I'm always going to coming back from summer holidays - I've always thought it was a daft time for the fest anyway - I like a nice beer when its a bit cold outside, and preferable dark or at least crespuscular.

On 20 Aug, 14:34, Chris de Cordova wrote: SNIP

SNIP

As far as being a woman alone, that would not be a problem at all... the vast majority of the working party and a heck of a lot of the senior workers are lasses - you know a lot of the Keighley & Craven lot and we have a very big presence down there (I can think of at least a dozen of us off the top of my head of which a 1/3rd are women). You would always be made mose welcome and if you let one if us know when you are coming we can make sure you're put with "a nice bunch" till you find your feet. LOL

Re August time....The only reason it changed from the original september time was when we moved to Brighton in 85 so as to hopefully pick up more holiday makers at the seaside... but then it was found that halls and student accom was cheaper and so were a lot of the bigger venues as it is classed as their "quiet" time & priced accordingly. It would be very interesting to see what the prices were for later dates for EC tho in 2012...

Re "off season in London" well I was amazed to get hotels for £28 per night B&B in the next street from EC and will certainly be booking there again next year... it was bliss to have a 3 minute "commute" and that extra hours lie in the morning (not to mention the extra time in the Volunteers Arms after the buzzes have left for the residences... ) very civilised!

Cheers All

Denny (Stock Control)

As true as that may be, prices this year for beer were high, but probably not appallingly so. I didn't like seeing we were charging over 3quid for many beers though.

The cost of getting in the door - 10 pounds on the day (most people) - seems simply exorbitant, up 25% on 2 years ago. I had an investment banker friend who had some mates call him away because they hadn't wanted to pay that much to get in.

I'm pretty numb to the pricing of the catering stalls there - it's apparent that they pay a fairly hefty whack to be there.

Does the festival make big profits for the organisation to fund other things or are we really just covering the cost of things?

I didn't really notice that, I just attributed the fact I was sweating like a pig the whole time downstairs mostly to working on the Festival Games, where one runs back and forth picking up balls, cheeses or mini barrels for a few hours at a stretch. Managed to squat down and have my shorts give up on me too, apparently another common side effect of that job. I noticed none of the commentary about Matt Hoggard mentioned his go on the skittles though...

Whereas the excellent and award winning Cannon Royall Fruiterers mild was available for just £2

Totally agree, Simon.

It's very sad. There seem to be people who rejoice in the fact that beer is becoming an up-market, high priced, trendy drink rather than the working man's thirst quencher it used to be.

All credit to your investment banker friend's mates! Perhaps you ought to direct them to Peterborough next year where the prices seemed to average out at about £2.20-£2.40. You'll have a better time and drink beer in a more appropriate and fun environment. And a minimal entry fee, if any at all!

And I have absolutely no connection with that festival! I have however being going to festivals for nearly 30 years and Peterborough, Liverpool and the Keighley and Worth Valley October Festival (not a CAMRA festival but with CAMRA support) rate as about the best. But far too 'rough and bare arsed' for those who see beer as a fashion statement rather than simply a bloody good drink.

Just a small plug for that one:

No connection with them, I just like good festivals.

Probably the same people who don't flinch at paying £x000 for a bottle of wine!

Seriously, though, you can't get in anywhere in London for less than a tenner these days - none of the tourist attractions are less than a tenner, none of the National Trust properties I have seen charge less than a tenner, and that's even outside London. Even Compton Verney (quite close to me in Warwickshire) charges nearer £20. Heck, even the parish church in Warwick charges £5 to get in!

I've thought for a long time we should be charging about a tenner for admission. The Doctor Who exhibition, on at the same time in Earls Court, charges £9 for just half an hour's entertainment - surely £10 is worth an entire beer festival!

As for your statement about the catering stalls, what actually comprises most of their fees is the charges for power they have to pay to a third party (i.e. not Earls Court and not Camra, although Camra administers it). That's pretty standard at all exhibition venues, including the one I'm exhibiting at this weekend.

All OK once you get to Manchester, but Manchester isn't as easy to get to as many other locations.

Sorry Christine - poor comparison, to my mind. Once in the Dr Who exhibition, can you enjoy yourself without spending any more money? Not so in GBBF.

Not to mention the fact that we're (mainly) also members of the organisation that is charging so much!

There was once an AGM motion that proposed free entry for Camra Members to Camra Beer Festivals at all times

I wouldn't go that far, but as someone who's been involved in the organisatiion and staffing of quite a few festivals I'd rather the punters spent the money over the bar than just getting in.

Manchester has good rail connections from all over the country, plus an international airport with lots of flights to and from Heathrow and Gatwick for the southern contingent - you can even get cheap fares on the routes!

I think this is about you comforable Londoncentric lot not wanting to have to pay for accommodation [1], or make the long trek across the country, both of which the rest of us have to do if we want to spend more than one day at GBBF in London.

In article , Simon Cooper writes

The more they make, the meaner they are.

Roy.

British Museum, Natural History Museum, Science Museum, National Gallery, Imperial War Museum, National Maritime Museum, National Portrait Gallery, Sir John Soane's Museum, Museum of London, National Army Museum, Horniman Museum, British Library, Queen's House, Royal Observatory. Palace of Westminster (but it is hassle).

All free.

The George:

and that's even outside London. Even Compton Verney (quite close to

But lots of CAMRA members got into GBBF for free and got free beer on top of that!

Actually it was free *or discounted* entry, and I think you will find that even the Great British Beer Festival adheres to that particular item.

A different motion from the same people to obtain free membership for the unemployed was not passed.

Brett... a écrit :

Yup, a good thousand of them, plus dozens from other european beer consumers organisations.

1. I live just outside Coventry and I'm Yorkshire born.
2. I intensely dislike London as a city. (probably genetic)
3. I stay in a hotel when I'm there - it's convenient for me and means the accommodation organiser has one less room to find.

As previously stated the current venue is about the only one that ticks all the boxes. I've been working at the Great British Beer Festival for 28 years (not even a break on the 1984 burned out venue replacement festival year) and I've seen it grow from a simple attempt at money raising to the major event it now is.

What the event is about is far more than just selling some beer, CAMRA members in the individual branches do an excellent job of that in the local and even regional festivals, it's about a large amount of PR that couldn't be done at a smaller festival (like the corporate hospitality) Sadly one of the major threads, press coverage, is far harder when you try and get the press boys to leave their cozy London holes.

I've been reading through this thread with much interest. I am a punter, life CAMRA member, freelance journalist, done my time as volunteer at many festivals all over the country, and judged at a fair number too, including GBBF 2008.

There are many valid points being made here by many people, but there are obvious recurring themes. I'd also like to interject with a few observations:

1. While each venue has advantages and disadvantages, most people preferred Olympia to Earls Court.
2. No venue is perfect - its just some are less perfect than others !
3. GBB Festivals have been run at other venues in the past outside the above....Brighton, Leeds etc. From the punters point of view, they havent been a "disaster". Headquarters dislike them as they dont earn them so much income.
4. CAMRA is fast becoming a corporate entity - their number one aim is to grow, make more income, and grow more. Yes they drive great campaigns - that is what CAMRA is for, but "grow" is top of the agenda.
5. Leaving London will reduce CAMRA's opportunity to grab thousands of tourists as potential members. Accept it - those in charge will not move it. The GBBF is CAMRA's number one recruiting exercise. Current members get small benefit from it, with expensive entry fees and beer. This is a deliberate policy of the executive, who do the pricing. I've spoken to breweries and the Wetherspoons people. They want to reduce their prices, and even give away beer, but CAMRA force them to charge inflated rates. Why should Bar Nouveau charge around a pound more than they do in their own pubs down the road ?
6. Another pricing question. How is it I (or any member of the public) can buy the latest West Coast (USA) Beer Guide new from Amazon (including postage) for less than I can as a member at GBBF ? I wrote to Whats Brewing about this, and surprise surprise they didnt publish, nor respond.......
7. While many of us help out volunteering, organising, setting-up, for small beer or a few tokens at festivals, the corporate boys behind the scenes watch over the coffers, doing what they can to maximise income, travelling around on expenses, and ensure we fall into line with headquarters guidelines.
8. Peterboro, Reading, Cambridge etc are fantastic alternative venues. Why ? They are run by local people, not the executive, and offer a much better value product. I dont care if I have to plan hard to get there, stand on grass, or avoid the odd puddle or leakage. And without doubt all the people are happier, and its infectious !
9. There is without doubt a growing dissatisfaction amongst the grass roots hard-core. I know several who now refuse to volunteer at GBBF any more. And isnt there a push from above to force local tented festivals to start charging members more ? (Cambridge comes to mind as an example.....).
10. For 2012, Matt's suggestion is by far the wisest and least disruptive - why not just move the date ?!?!?!

Now dont get me wrong - I am not against CAMRA. I hope to reman an active member for a long time but I also intend to make my voice heard. Dont accept that those in charge always get everything right - they dont ! The campaign to force guest beers into pubs led to limitations on the number of pubs owned by breweries, and the formation of the pub companies. This is an unnecessary set of middlemen that also take a profit out of the "brewer to punter" system. Yes the availability of real ale has increased, but it is much more expensive than it needs to be.

phew, enough from me this miserable rainy bank holiday in Ilfracombe

alebuff