[TEA] posting with a prefix

seems (TEA) works if you guys want to chime in as to usefulness of posting with a prefixed subject

-may be better visible between spams

-unknowing posters may not know

If you're trying out things like this, why not use alt.test?

/Lew

Better yet, use a real news reader and news service.

AP

i dont think so since google read+writes to usenet, how is that NOT a real news reader or service?

I've stayed out of all of the recent posts about spam and newsreaders/ usenet... but I'll hop in here just to clarify. Google is NOT a good representation of the Usenet experience.

On the "reader" side, if you will, your interface to the newsgroups, it is very limited and basic. It is like doing fine graphic work with Microsoft Paint vs. a professional app like Photoshop. Sure, they are both image editing programs but one can do thousands of things more and better.

On the server side, Google's, they do very little beyond basic interfacing with news servers. Sure you can post and read, but not much else.

Now a true news client program has thousands of options and features that address all of the problems you are facing. They allow you to have a killfile to "ignore" individuals who post that you don't care to read, or to block threads you deem SPAM that somehow passed the servers filters, and much more.

A real news server does a lot of filtering for spam, crossposts, etc. Google doesn't.

Of course this is a basic explanation but hopefully it helps clarify some of Google's shortcomings. Google offers web-based news reading/ posting, no less no more. A real newsreader client in conjunction with a real news server offers much more, more and much less, less.

well, technically it is a 'real' news reader and server, yes, web based, dumbed down, simplified. since it manages to do the job of uuencoding, uudecoding, posting, processing messages using the usenet nntp protocols, messages propagate to other news servers, therefore it is able to communicate using the required standards.

more than 10 years ago there was almost no newsgroup spam, so when they didnt have enough filtering back then it means they were not real ?

google groups may not be how some people like it but it doesnt mean its not 'real'.

what you're trying to say by a 'real' server is a PAID newsservice provider and as you pay more, you get more (usually).

i dont know a newsreader software that has these 'thousands' of features and options, more like a dozen features.

Holy shit, are you serious? OK, time to go sit in the corner and take your meds.

I was generalizing for the folks who aren't technical, but enjoy the group and don't know a world exists outside of Google Groups. Please, save your bullshit with me. I never said you had to pay for a news server, see many people get access to their ISP's news server for FREE, but never even know it. And FYI, many news clients are free/open source so again no one has to pay for anything.

I honestly can't believe how inane people can be online at times. You get a gold star for being one of the few on this NG to actually make me angry with your trivial garbage.

- Dominic

i will save my bullshit, store it in a ziploc, and promise to take my meds next time!

but would you like to show me where this "bullshit" is at?

google reads&posts messages that propagate to all of usenet? doesnt do files so it doesnt need the uuenc/yenc etc, ok with that. my bad

paid server (NH)... most of the spam as here in google groups isp server... most of the spam as well would you like me to compare the list of messages for an exact comparison?

free readers, i can count (when im on the meds) but i dont see thousands of features maybe you have the real reader with thousands of features, but since you did not port it to windows i am not able to find/use it!

i guess because you cant use news.google.com:119 you are very upset!

your reply is highly brutal and inane as well, please drink some green tea and relax.

If it's any help, I use Outlook express, access the group through my ISP, and there's a spot in Expess where I can put in words that, if in a post, will block the post. I'm not sure whether my ISP just has incredibly good spam blockers or whether it's my list of spam words (or both), but I have not received any of the adult spams (npot a single one), the only ones I get (if you term them spam) are the drive-by teashop posters.

I'm sure there must be a Firefox newsgroup reader out there someplace, I jsut haven't bothered to look since Express is filling my requirements right now.

Melinda

Look, I have precious little time to argue on the Internet about such silly stuff. I come to RFDT to get away from that mentality that pervades most online communication. I made it clear that I stay away from these types of posts for exactly this reason, and you were there to help illustrate my point quite well.

I was, and stated, generalizing... and yes even exaggerating to make a point. I have used many news readers and yes I have seen many that range into tons of options. When it comes to binaries, PAR, compression, etc. on top of all the standard features, web-based remote control, queuing, and on and on.

As I stated Google Groups is like using a watered down, basic, application. For the folks who are unaware that any other way to interface with this group exists I was offering some leads to follow and research if they cared to without getting technical and specific.

Honestly, I could care less about your argument. My statements stand, disagree if you want and preach about uuencoding to a bunch of folks who like tea and could care less.

oh, and see there is this other feature a "real" news reader has called a killfile... welcome to mine.

- Dominic

Ten years ago, servers didn't have filtering and cleanfeed didn't exist. BUT, the clients were the same.

Ten years ago the standard clients had EXTENSIVE filtering, not to deal with spam, but to deal with the huge amount of legitimate traffic that a user might not want to read. Ten years ago, the filtering available on the most basic newsreader was far more extensive than anything google has available.

It's an abomination. It is a phenomenally crude and slow interface. It is run by idiots who make no attempt to control abusive users. Google has done more to damage Usenet than anything else out there, even AOL's now-discontinued fiasco.

No, most ISPs provide NNTP service as part of your basic fee for internet service. There is no reason to pay for a commercial NNTP provider unless you are going to be reading news from a wide variety of different locations.

I am using rn, and have been for about twenty years now. It has regular expressions for message selection, which is a couple thousand features right there. It's about as crude as a newsreader gets, and it's a hell of a lot more powerful than google.

--scott

Many ISPs do provide their customers with NNTP servers, but they also limit the retention rates and the number of groups to very constraining servings. For the most part, I notice that those ISPs who still do provide their customers with news service, also tend to limit the retention of group down to less than 30 days or worse, sometimes even something like a week or such. This makes it very difficult to effectively track, search, archive, or carry on long threads.

Yup. It's called Thunderbird.

Best of luck in that.

I see you've found the switch to put your added text in the right place. My compliments on that. Outhouse comes with it defaulted wrong, and most people never change it.

AP

I think the adjective you're looking for is "stupidified".

Nobody is really dising Google, but there are better ways of accessing Usenet, and if you don't like Google then you should look them up, rather than trying to bend Usenet behavior to suit Google.

Usenet is where spam got started. It was only later that people, oh, I mean spammers, since spammers aren't really people, got the idea of mining Usenet for email addresses and using broadcast email to get free access to lots of eyeprints.

That happened in 1994, and by 1997 (that would be 10 year ago) spam was still in its infancy. Back at that time I could still complain to the abuse address for each and every spam message I received.

Google Groups was formerly known as DejaNews, and Google acquired them in 2001.

If you like it then use it. Just don't expect the internet to bend to your will, or to Google's.

Not at all. I use Brighthouse's news servers, which come with my subscription to their internet service. OTOH, I do pay for it with my subscription fee. After all, TANSTAAFL. The one thing that bothers me about Brighthouse's Usenet feed is that I can't access their servers outside of their network, so when I'm not at home I'm screwed. This is really where paid internet services come in handy.

BTW: If you have an ISP that doesn't provide a Usenet feed as part of your subscription then get a better ISP.

True. "Thousands" is an exaggeration, certainly. Same comment applies.

AP

So don't. Nobody is tying you to your chair and forcing you at gunpoint to argue with noobs about how great Google groups is(n't).

So why are you still arguing this one?

Why don't you take his advice and drink some green tea and relax. Maybe a tisane of Chamomile?

AP

So, you came by 4 days later and decided to offer me that suggestion, eh? Johnny on the spot there. Ugh, the joys of the Intarwebs. I hate to say it, but I think my time at RFDT is coming to an end... enjoy blogging about such amazing topics as Martha Stewart and K-Mart and trying to sound high-and-mighty on "teh Intartoobz." I'll just go back to enjoying tea and not obsessing. I am here to offer people a level- headed view of tea and how to begin and grow in enjoying tea.

I have worked in IT for over 13 years now, and have worked on classified projects that help keep you safe daily... arguing about a newsreader and newsgroups is not high on my list. People like you and SN enjoy that sort of thing, I don't. I simply jumped into this thread because misinformation was beginning to get out of hand and I wanted to offer folks who only know of Google Groups a glimpse at what is out there and options due to the current state of affairs. I knew it was a mistake (as it always is because everyone is an expert on the Internet) and it was. Again, thanks for hammering that point home even further than it already was.

Goodnight.

- Dominic

Sorry my turnaround time isn't up to your standards.

Again, sorry if my blog isn't up to date enough for you. You'll note that it is no more, or less, inane than 99.9% of the other blogs on the internet. And I, frankly, don't care to live my life in public on the internet, as many bloggers seem to do.

I didn't go near that subject, DON'T put words in my mouth.

That sounds like the best idea.

Your opinions on tea are well regarded, and you seem to be able to keep decent manners when writing about it.

I have had a connection to the internet almost continuously since 1983. Do you even remember the pre-DNS internet?

My best friend has worked in IT for 25 years.

I have never worked in IT myself. I'm not nearly autistic enough. I spend to much time IRL.

Oh, how many times have I heard that?

My father in law wrote a piece of the code for Ohio class submarines, and another piece of the code for Aegis class cruisers. A friend of mine programs cockpit applications for the Space Shuttle. Another friend wrote some of the code for the Boeing 757/767 control systems. And another friend works for a TLA he doesn't talk about. I myself spent some time in the shooting end US Army Aviation.

Sorry, Dominic. I'm not impressed.

Granted, but you could do it without coming to the edge of verbally abusing a newbie.

I'm an old hand, but I never claimed to be an expert. You know the old saying, "An 'ex' is a has-been, and a 'spurt' is a drip under pressure."

You're welcome.

And on that note I'm going to let this thread drop. You can have the last word, Dominic, if you're amind to.

AP

Yep, I'm amind to. You have no idea about what you speak, but if it makes you feel better, go for it. You are nothing to me, this discussion is nothing to me, your uninformed opinion of what I know and have experienced is ignorant at best and means nothing to me. I will not defend myself, I'm tired of this drivel, and it is time for me to break away from RFDT. It has sadly fallen far away from what it was, if it ever comes back around I'll be the first to help it back on track.

Your profile shows that you offer very little in substance or original content but enjoy arguing and strongly tossing your opinions around as fact on all manner of issues. Typical Internet style (pre or post DNS). Please step up in the group and prove me wrong, you can fill my shoes easily.

- Dominic