1964

Old hat Bill, it is done all the time. Most countries even have laws against it. It is called dumping. The Japanese have been doing it to us for years. All countries do to try to gain market share where they are dumping and bring in foreign currency. Australia ships a lot of lobster tails to the US and we buy them cheaper than the Australians can buy them at home.

If a Toyota enters a US port with a lower price tag than it is sold for at home, it will be sent back. It is all about balance of trade. I guess that we are just lucky in the US that we have the government protecting us from those cheap prices that always cause a stigma for the consumer.

Ed, it was really just a joke. :-)

Yeah - what he said.

Must have forgotten the smileys.....or maybe our friends from across the border are a mite tender right now? ;-))

And PS, Ed - if it WERE a serious discussion, arguing by analogy with Southeast Asian antibiotics is beneath YOU - that sort of misdirection doesn't really address the realities of the drugs selling for more in the US than here in Canada, when the drugs are identical. The fear-mongering about Canadian or European drugs being inferior that we have heard (not referring to you) are a bit of a clinker when the drugs sold in the US are often made by the same people as the less expensive drugs sold here.

Now if I could figure out why Italian wines seem to cost less here while French wines seem to cost more......

1970, 1971, 1975 (a fave of mine), 82, 90, 93 (a real star in that vintage), 95, 98, 2000, 01.......

Graves...right bank wines...even some Medoc. St. Estephe and Pauillac took it the worst from the rains. Some of those were okay if they picked early enough. I'm also a 1964 boy (birthday this past weekend) and I just passed on some Pichon Lalande '64. Price wasn't right and, while it was supposed to have been not at all a bad wine, all recent notes I've seen have it a short way into the (not so long?) slide down. I've not tasted it myself.

If you don't want to pop for a claret, what about Rioja. Not sure whether they are held back by the domaine or by a distributor, but I sometimes see old Riscal and Ygay wines hitting the market with decent availability and reasonable prices. '64 was supposed to have been landmark in Rioja.

Good luck,

Jim

Hi folks, I too am a Canadian. I drive a Subaru Outback built in Indiana. Base Outback US price with Automatic Transmission is $25,870.00 US. The Canadian equally equipped Out Back is $34,195.00 CND. This looks fairly equal to me. Canadian $ is running about $.81 Us right now. In fact $34,195 CDN is $27,698.00 US. This one does not hold true to Bill's experience.

I do know that BMW imported the Mini into Canada below the US price and Canadian buyers have to sign an agreement with BMW not to resell their car in the USA. The agreement is not with any government it is between the customer and BMW. I know that US representatives have been to Canadian Auto Auctions because late model used cars in the US sell at a higher price than they do here.

Last winter I read a piece about the Ford Crown Vic being sold for less in Canada and that Ford was prosecuting their own dealers who cross border traded and Ford voided the vehicles warranties.

Subaru has a stripped down Impresa model sold only in Canada because Canadian's have baulked at their entry price point. What does this have to do with making Wine? or helping the original fellow buy a bottle of 1964 wine for his brother. My humble guess would be that a red Cabernet may be in better shape than a white after 40 years in the bottle.

Take care

Bob Patrick

Hhhhmmmmm !

Discretion dictates that I should hold my own tongue, but I have always subscribed to "In for a penny; In for a Pound!" - so here goes, for a perspective from outside of North America, (since I was the one who initially encouraged "parallel-debate" on matters in respect to politics, international trade as it affects wine etc)

Firstly, I generally congratulate everyone on the standard of debate - but, would encourage the use of emoticons and smilies to indicate when one is being satirical. ;-))

I find it very interesting; this Canada/US debate - much the same happens between Australia and NZ; and generally, it is always a case of "trade-protectionism" by another name.

And the pharmaceutical debate will only increase.

I recently read that patents will expire, in the next year, on products with a combined market value totalling $US70 billion per year, and India is gearing up to target the lions share of that market.

Many generic "copies" of off-patent drugs, produced in India are already on the market around the world; many imported by a local companies in bulk, and packaged and sold under a generic label. (I quote the NZ example here)

The NZ agency responsible for procuring drugs for public hospitals uses one criteria only - price - thus most of the off-patent drugs used in NZ hospitals are the generic copies, sourced from India.

And despite the advertising campaigns waged by the big companies, and their scaremongering, I have never heard of one major health related problem associated with the use of generics.

Many other instances of trade protectionism border on the ridiculous.

NZ pioneered the "improved breeding" and international marketing of kiwifruit - and some enterprising (read stupid!) NZer sold cuttings or some of the best root stock to both Italy and the US.

In a very short time, growers from both countries were seeking tariffs and quotas against NZ because our fruit was both better and cheaper!

Go figger!!!!!

Now, a little note about your recent elections, and this is pure s**t-stirring, OK :-)))))

I know that this was a tough battle, with polarised views on both sides - but, generally, from an outside perspective (and we got a lot of media coverage), if both candidates were true to their word in respect to ridding the world of state sponsored terrorism and w.m.d., then surely, if you are going to go in and kick the snot out of Iraq, on the basis that you

*thought* they had w.m.d, then the next target *must* be Israel, who you *know* (irrefutably) does possess nuclear weapons and continues to build nuclear weapons, and has done so, with the knowledge and complicity of the US for nearly 30 years, clearly in violation of the n.p.t.

And if, as reported, morality *is* one of the key major factors in the re-election of GB, then the US is morally bound to invade Israel.

(Note - Last two paragraphs written with tongue in cheek, and foot firmly in mouth!!!)

Hello "Jim Jones"....

Have you tried the La Lagune (Haut Medoc)? One of my favorites, although I've never tried the '64. I'm currently looking to bid on a case of all

60's, including 2 bottles of '64 La Lagune's and 1 bottle of '64 Picon Lalande. As for the Pichon Lalande by itself, what would you say is a fair price to pay? Thanks in advance.

\/

Have not tried the La Lagune '64 nor seen any notes. Low-to-mid $200's is probably market for the Pichon Lalande '64. That's a European price. US retail would likely be higher.

Do you have any of Michael Broadbent's tasting books? Although the three books are, in concept, quite similar, each is significantly different as Broadbent has dropped some older notes and updated thoughts on some vintages (as well as included new notes and wines from releases and tastings between editions). If you are going to buy old wines (especially claret), this is a must-own book. There was an edition sometime in the (early??) '90s called "Great Vintage Wine Book". The most recent was published '02 and is called "Vintage Wine: Fifty Years of Tasting Three Centuries of Wines".

For getting a sense of vintage and longevity, as well as voluminous notes on major wines (and a surprising number of notes on lesser wines), I think there is no better source. Parker's Bordeaux books are much more complete for more recent vintages, but Broadbent's notes are a hell of a lot of fun to read and much more useful, I think. Broadbent writes notes the way I would like to be able to write them and he doesn't use that damn 100-point scale. He uses a five-star scale that does a good job of revealing both current and potential pleasure.

Final thoughts --

Broadbent's most recent note on the Pichon Lalande '64 (tasted in

1995) was a positive note, but basically finished with the message to "hurry up and drink".

La Lagune is certainly at the safer end of the Medoc for a '64, but I'm not sure how strong it was in the early '60s. There was tons of replanting done there in the '50s, so vines were pretty new. I've not tasted anything from La Lagune older than '82.

Good luck,

Jim

I've had 1978, 1976, 1975, 1970 and 1966, but never 1964, which I believe is long past it.

I believe that only the best of the 64s are still worth drinking and to avoid getting a tired one, I'd probably stick to better right bank wines.

The Figeac, Soutard and Trotanoy and from the other side of the river, Latour and Montrose pretty much exhaust the really worthwhile wines.

What about Petrus and Cheval Blanc, Bill? Parker at least thinks that they were very successful in '64 and should have the guts to still be alive now. Do your experiences say differently? Regarding '64 clarets in general, the fact that it was such a hot growing season suggests to me that many of the wines may not have had the acids for long-term aging, although as always there are bound to be the exceptions.

Mark Lipton

I omitted them only because of real world financial restraints.

If you can afford them go for it!

Really....I thought these would be cheaper in Canada :-(

I should clarify this a little. This is a wine-searcher result. I'm too cheap to pop for the pro version, so I get limited results.

I wouldn't pay this for the '64 Pichon Lalande. (1) By all reports, it's cracking up or at least headed that way. (2) $200 is simply a lot of money compared to what else is on the market. (3) I passed on it at $155 in Tokyo.

Returning to my mention of '64 Rioja...

I did see both the '64 Lopez Heredia Gran Riservas on a list the other day (the Bosconia and the Tondonia). These are old-school Rioja that are built to last. These are library releases (wines are typically aged 6-8 years in oak, then held in bottle at the bodega for delayed release). A number of places in the US have these wines in the $150 to $180 range. I've not seen them here in Tokyo or I would pick up a mixed case for future birthdays. Coming from the winery, the storage should have been good (provided they actually got shipped right).

Based on my admittedly limited experience combined with a number of good notes from others, the Bosconia is more fruit driven, the Tondonia more blessed with secondary complexity. I've not tasted the '64s, but have had the '76s. Be warned, the Tondonia is not for palates attuned to Cal Cab or new-school Italian.

Lopez Heredia also produce old-style Blanca that is supposed to be excellent and lighter Rosada that is for more basic drinking. I've had neither, though I would love a shot at the Blanca (of which I have seen the Tondonia '76 in the US market around $80).

If I were buying '64s, Rioja is probably where I'd head. (Although a little Trotanoy or something similar might be a good balancing buy!)

In any case, enjoy.

Jim

Note that according to article I found online Minis cannot be resold anywhere in Canada without Dealer getting first rights of refusal within one year.

If you can find other info online I would be interested in this.

Here is article that mentions that

Or even worse you could have Rumsfeld, Bush, Ashcroft, Limbaugh, Hannity, and Paul ONeil :)

Lew/+Silat Drafted 69 Army Artillery FDC