Good example of better Chardonnay?

I suspect the answer to this is extremely variable and is largely based on the expectations of the individual judges.

In the case of the 1976 Paris tasting, the panel *knew* they were tasting California vs. France and they doubtlessly had specific expectations of what a good French wine should taste like and were inclined to select French over Californian, all other things equal. In fact, the judges were documented making biased judgments:

From:

I suppose we can debate it, but it's clear to me that terrior was an important element of the judge's expectations, and they simply couldn't taste it.

If those judges were tasting truly blind, no idea what was being poured, their expectations would certainly have been different. I believe this is true of anyone tasting wine, myself included.

Dana

That's Domaine de la Bongran, Monsieur Hoare... ;-)

Excellent wine, and even in its more affordable Cuvee Levroutee it is wonderful. The dry version is one of the best QPR wines in Burgundy, with the chardonnay ripening fully in this very southern end of Burgundy, and a winemaker that likes to let his grapes ripen all the way.

BTW, the botrytis is only made very seldom, in suitable years, hence these wines are a true treat, and rare.

QED

Mike

Hmmm - I guess I'll contact Alois Kracher on that subject.

M.

P.S.: Done. I just mailed him from his homepage, - quite interesting read, btw!

Yes Dale, sorry for the misspelling ("S" is next to "D" on the keyboard. Yes, I do use AOL and I check the unfiltered (it seems to take them a while to show up there and often they show up with imbedded codes.

Bi!!

Salut/Hi Mike Tommasi,

le/on Wed, 31 Dec 2003 12:19:53 +0100, tu disais/you said:-

Oh bugger, yes. Thanks.

Yup, I think so too.

Salut/Hi Michael Pronay,

le/on 31 Dec 2003 13:06:25 GMT, tu disais/you said:-

Now all we've got to do is fix a date for the AFW picnic week here that Tom S can make, and make sure both wines are available for tasting!

Ian Hoare wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

.kracher.at>

Just don't make it in late March because then I won't have an excuse not to travel down from Paris (Hey I might just skip the wedding in Lille (and have my family talk about me behind my back? No, I think I will still do the wedding. Families they are almost as rough as a.f.w regulars )

I don't see how that answers his question, interesting though it is. By the way, based on the list shown (top Cabernet Californian, and 2nd 3rd and 4th Cabernets French), which would you rather drink in general?

One interesting quote: "Incredibly, not a single wine expert noticed that the "red" wine they were drinking was actually white. This is astonishing, since the difference between white and red is not unlike the difference between beer and rye. It's so obvious, even I can tell the difference."

That just isn't so. It's surprisingly hard to tell some whites from some reds when your eyes are closed. (Kind of like telling what kind of fruit juice you're drinking if your nose is plugged.) Granted, any "experts" should be able to.

My preference from that list would be the 9th place 1970 Heitz "Martha's Vineyard". I'd bet that wine scored so low because the French tasters easily identified it as non-French. It was a blockbuster in its youth, and is still holding well (tasted ~1 year ago).

In general, I prefer big California Cabernets, but I do have a taste for good Bordeaux - particularly Haut Brion and Lafite. I'm just not willing to PAY for them! >:^[

Tom S

You're correct and to prove it Riedel has intoduced an opaque black tasting glass so that you cannot tell the color of the wine that you're tasting. Bi!!

My questionable was (I hope) more interesting. I meant if you had to choose between random French wines and random California wines, knowing that the top wine was Californian, but the 2nd 3rd and 4th wines were French, which would you pick? California or France?

FWIW, when I go shopping for Cabernet, I'm usually looking for a California wine. I barbecue a lot, and I find that the fully ripe California style Cabernet goes better with that. I'm not saying that I don't also enjoy Bordeaux, but a wine of equivalent quality from Bordeaux will generally be a lot more expensive, and might be best enjoyed with different types of food.

How did we get so off topic? I thought we were discussing Chardonnay.

Tom S

I think that closer to reality is that the top wine is French, but the

So in your example I would be more likely to randomly select a French wine over a California wine - and indeed in the $100+ range that is exactly what I do. However, I would never pay $60 for a 3rd growth over a similarly-priced California cab unless I had tasted them (or had some other external reference as to quality).

I think cab is a varietal which does very well in California. Now what about chardonnay?

Dimitri

Neyers, the company that produces an "over-the-top" Zindandel, also produces an "over-the-top" Chardonnay. It costs around $50/bottle and may be worth it.

Less is more. Well...maybe not

Regards,

Kent Feiler