Question from beginner

snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

I guess I should also say I have no basement or stairs also I live in TX and the garage is out of the question as it is 100 degrees outside. Also how much smell is there during initial fermentation?

I can relate to your situation. I live in Arizona and have no basement (no one does here).

At the start, you might have some overflow if its warm and the yeast gets too excited. Make sure you allow for that no matter where you place your primary. There's not too much smell from the fermentation. I've noticed that some produce a yeasty smell for the first few days, but other than that, nothing too obnoxious. Look for the darkest, coolest place in your home. Perhaps a closet or cabinet not against an outside wall. The coventional wisdom seems to be that reds ferment at higher temperatures better than whites (the resulting wine is better), and meads fermented at a higher temp may require more aging to allow the fusel alcohols to dissipate.

Greg

RE.....Also how much smell is there during initial fermentation?

There is nothing to worry about if you live alone. Wives tend not to enjoy the fremantation process. Myself,I think the odor of a good ferment is quite wonderful.

I live in far south Texas near Corpus Christi, and I just made my first batch of wild Mustang grape wine. I did my first fermentation in a spare bedroom that is only used when the kids come to stay. The smell was negligible and did not venture outside of the room, and left no lingering traces. Temperature in that closed off bedroom were about 84-86 Fahrenheit. I moved the carboy into the main part of the house for secondary, where we maintain a temp of about 78 Fahrenhiet. It's just too expensive to cool off a room just for the wine. :^) I have no idea what to do for racking and bottling storage yet. I am probably a week away from the end of secondary and it won't be cooling off here for a couple of months, and then not very much. I had thought of using an old refrigerator but read that vibration from the compressor will interfere with settling of lees and clearing. I may build a small insulated enclosure of some type or modify a closet as such and blow cold air from a window unit or something. My electric bill already runs about 6+k a year so cooling down the whole house to the low 70s is out of the question, and it would feel like living in the arctic to us. :^)

Quixote

I have kind of an odd situation here... My wife and I moved to Maine (not a whole lot of wine production) from California (lots of wine production). So what do we find in the basement of our new home in Maine? A very large, very insulated wine cellar. The guy who lived in the house before us was a wine nut, and he built this wine cellar. The basement stays around 76 degrees all summer and the wine cellar is always in the low 50s so we have a perfect place for primary and secondary fermentation and also aging and storage.

I'm just about to bottle my third set of 30 bottles so I have to start building some wine racks in the wine cellar. Anyone have any good plans for a simple wine rack that will hold 150 bottles or so?

I think the problems with vibration are generally overstated. I've been sticking white wines in the refrigerator for a few weeks after racking for the last time and they always seem to clear just fine. I also have several small wine coolers with compressors... so far all of my prized possessions are aging gracefully.

Greg

hmm. My wife likes the smell of primary in the morning! Guess I'm lucky. We have 2-3 in primary most of the time.

No help on the rack, but when you want to sell your house, let me know. smile. wow. Basement AND a wine cellar!

I have settled in on the thought of using a refrigerator after bottling, but my main and present concern is the first racking to the carboy (5 gallon) after secondary has ended, and any subsequent rackings required. How important are lower temperatures at this stage? I realize I am already working in warmer conditions than are recommended and probably have little leeway as it is.

Quixote

Bob Becker wrote: [snip] Anyone have any good plans for a

Bob,

I have a drawing of plans I made for my cellar rack. It's a modular setup, and can hold as many cases as you'd like. It consists of ladder-like uprights connected with horizontals across the front. It was made entirely of 1"x3" furring strips and joined with 1-5/8 deck screws. I made a jig to speed up assembly of multiple uprights, but that's not necessary.

If you'd like, I could email you the file (466kb).

Bob Becker wrote "I'm just about to bottle my third set of 30 bottles so I have to start

Bob, this is about as simple as it gets. Along one wall in my basement I have my wine rack. It consists of concrete blocks, two high, topped with a self board. Then two more concrete blocks and another self board. This continues as high as you want it. I space the concrete block risers far enough apart so 5 or 6 gallons (25 to 30 bottles) of bottled wine will fit in each section. It actually looks quite nice IMO. I put the smooth, narrow ends of the blocks facing outward. You can buy the shelf boards from Home Depot or another similar store. Concrete blocks can be purchased about anywhere.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas USA

I like this idea! But if I'm understanding the setup correctly, how do you keep the bottles from rolling back and forth after you've taken out 10-12 of the bottles?

___________________________________ block bottles in here block block bottles in here block block bottles in here block

Is this right?

Hmm.. this wouldn't be a preferable solution if you are in an area that could shake, like us here in CA. You would lose your entire collection with the first 3+ earthquake.

I have a scalloped version that interlocks with wooden 2X4's that I purchased from a wholesaler before I got my big boy wine fridges. It's raw wood, but worked fine and keeps the bottles from rolling/dropping and wasn't that expensive.

My partner loves it. She knows that it keeps the wine rack full.

Bob -The space between blocks is 24 inches. This is enough space for 8 bottles to lie in each row, in each cavity. The next row just lies on top of the bottles below. Just take them from the top of each row and no bottles roll around at all. Each cavity will hold 25 to 30+ bottles easily so you can put 5 to 6 gallons of bottled wine in it's own section.

I live in Kansas...there is no earthquake activity here. We do have tornados but I've never seen one in over 60 years. Even if you do have some rumblings in CA I bet this wine rack will hold it's own. It's pretty substantial with the big blocks, etc.

To keep the bottles from falling out I put a 2x2 board beneath the necks of the first row of bottles in each section. This tilts the bottles up a bit so they don't lie flat or slant forward...they tilt back a bit...but corks are still covered with wine.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas USA

Bob Becker wrote "But if i'm understanding the setup correctly, how do you keep the bottles from rolling back and forth after you've taken out 10-12 of the bottles?

My Name wrote in news:9Iqyg.12990$ snipped-for-privacy@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net:

If I understand correctly there is little smell assocatied with fermentation. If so I can just store it in my pantry in the kitchen since we keep or whole house between 75 and 80 year round. I want to thank all or you for your replies and be prepared for more questions to come as I really am a beginner at this.

Ah! Gotcha! Now it all makes sense. Can't get too much simpler or cheaper. I like it.

Not a problem anymore. I live in Maine now. I don't miss the earthquakes too much.

Cool. You could also use the board to label the type of wine and year bottled.

Thanks for the ideas, Bill!

No basement, no wine cellar, and 100+ degrees in the garage? You're making it tough. I also live in a hot climate, but have the blessing of a stand alone outbuilding that, over the years, we've converted into a 'winery'.

I live in the Sierra Foothills in California, where it's hot in the summer, but by crush time (October) the temps have moderated considerably - I do primary fermentation of reds in large open plastic bins (Macro bins). I do those under an awning outside, and keep them covered with plastic (you can buy it in sheets from the hardware store) affixed with tape. I do my white wine primary fermentation in large plastic buckets; I start fermentation in a shed we converted to winemaking; temps in the shed at that time of year range from high 60's to low 80's. Once fermentation is well underway, I move the fermenting white wine into a large cooled and insulated cellar / cool room (built into the wine shed), where air temps are kept in the low 60's during fermentation. Reds and whites both age in the cool room at somewhat lower temps.

If you have a room that you can insulate, keep cool, and don;t mind making a mess in, then do so; you'll make better wine. It occurs to me that even a second bathroom could be converted. The trick will be keeping it relatively cool efficiently. Insulate the heck out of it, and use a single room air conditioner if you have to.

As for the smell - it's all in the nose of the beholder. I really like the smell of fermenting wines. But I guess not everyone does.