Hogaarden short measures at JD Wetherspoons

Bastards - they're now forcing dogs to drink beer? ;-)

Gareth.

The little buggers insist on it ;-)

Stick t' whippets I say. They aren't as fussy.

In message , Paul Sherwin wrote

Furthermore, Northern brewers spend a lot more money on expensive ingredients because after the s**t has been knocked out the pint via the sparkler not a lot of the original flavour is left.

Stoke was in Yorkshire in 1971?

No, but it was north of Birmingham in 1971. You'll be hard pressed to find a pub there now that doesn't use bloody sparklers. I know sparklers were used in Yorkshire and parts of Lancs by 1971 (indeed, around 1965) but the contagion hadn't spread any further.

Best regards, Paul

-- Paul Sherwin Consulting

Gareth wrote: [...]

I am reminded of a trip to a pub in Birmingham where the landlord has selected the bar staff for appearance rather than brains or talent. This twink was a stunning example of the genre, and the Banks's Number Nine was also a stunning example of the "beer" available in there, and indeed for quite a distance around.

Number Nine is a "creamflow" beer, which means that it's got more in common with lemonade than beer. I had the poor judgement to order a pint of this. Some bright spark had also put a sparkler on the tap. Unfortunately, after pulling a pint of froth, it never quite occured to Einstein here that perhaps the sparkler shouldn't be there.

After about ten minutes the bar looked like a snow scene.

I supped my "pint" (i.e. quarter of a pint of actual beer, and three quarters of froth) and resolved never to go anywhere near that pub ever again.

I haven't seen an autovac in years. I thought that they were illegal these days (environmentla health legislartion etc.).

Martin

In message , Gareth writes

Before the trolls try to misinterpret this - the GBG lists the breweries recommended serving style, CAMRA just ask them.

It might seem amateurishbut what do you suggest berwers do?

IMO it's fiendishly difficult as a brewer to impose your 'instructions' regarding how your beer should be served, when you factor in the opinions of the landlord & drinker - that's if you ever meet either of them, as much beer is sent out via wholesalers, etc.

Landlords may have various good or bad reasons for serving with some or lots of head, and many drinkers prefer the look of the head, and perhaps the subdued milder flavour of the beer underneath? MikeMcG.

Steve Pampling wrote that over-big head on beer is

I can honestly say I have almost never experienced a pint of real ale that had too much condition, and absolutely regularly received the opposite (i.e. flat, whether with a head after being "sparkled" or without).

Ideally I like good spritzt carbonation/condition in my beer, and maybe a little fluffy head (i.e. not sparkled to death), more so on a stout or mild - but I'm a fussy bugger. MikeMcG

re Mike Roebuck's post - Rooster's and sparklers

I dunno if you've seen this, from the horse's mouth -

served in the North of

because the CO2 had

changed in favour of the

admit I don't know why

'sparklers'.

matters above all is

As a Yorks brewer, he's being pretty diplomatic, but I wouldn't want my beer to be "smudged", to lose the condition I'd worked hard to help create, or to have my good bitter beer softened and sweetened by the sparkler. cheers MikeMcG

Don't think so, not so long as a clean glass is used every time.

Surely it's the exttremely tight sparkler that prohibits oversized glasses, rather than the autovac itself, though?

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:21:50 +0000, MikeMcG wrote (in message ):

No I'm well aware that whatever the brewers instructions maybe they cannot impose them, but they don't even put the information in the public domain. In some case brewers with tied estates don't even seem pass the information on to their own pubs and they can impose them!

What do I suggest they do? Well for instance it is not hard to have a retailers section on your company website. Every brewer has to write spiel about their beers at some point, instead of banging on about dwarfs and 'only brewed with the finest quality ingredients' which tell us nothing they could start by telling us something useful.

This is something I've remarked upon before. It surprises me that (more) brewers don't have a section on their website giving cellaring and/or serving guidelines for their beers. Surely it's in their interests to help the publican serve their beer in the best condition possible?

Hear hear.

Martin

The only way CAMRA got the information out of brewers was to task the BLO's (Brewery Liaison Officers) with the single mission of getting the information as a "with" or "without" in answer to a question about whether they brewed specific beers to be served with or without a sparkler.

From my experience it was relatively easy for most small brewers, but I gather that the larger ones made it more like pulling your own teeth - slow and painful.

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:27:21 +0000, MikeMcG wrote (in message ):

If you're choosy about your beer you're fussy, if you're choosy about your wine you're a connoisseur!

Hmmm. I've long felt that many "connoisseurs" aren't that fussy about wines that "fussy" beer drinkers would shudder at.

Hmmm, fair enough.

Good ideas about info on website, etc. I also think the ingredients should in general be better explained, tho perhaps not to the obsessive level of some breweries(*) I guess in a way that's what Sean Franklin does (see elsewhere in this thread) - without proscribing to landlords/drinkers how his beer should be served, he tells them the likely effects of serving them thru a sparkler.

(*) such as respected US micro, Rogue (whose bottles tell you the exact yeast strain, 'free range coastal water', the colour specs of the crystal malt, etc!)

BTW I intend to get my beers brewed only by the finest dwarves, using only dwarf-hops. cheers MikeMcG

No, it's more the fact that an autovac recirculates the overspill from the glass that's being poured, so it's practically impossible to judge the amount that finally finishes up in the glass. Top-ups are possible, though take time. Using oversized glasses would mean reducing the amount of liquid in the glass to the line every time, IMO.

They need clean glasses, but also well-trained staff, to make sure overspill lands in the correct hopper (and that it doesn't run over the barperson's fingers in the process, preferably).

Autovacs save landlords lots of money, as there is very, very little waste beer.

-- Cheers

Mike in Moscow mikedotroebuckatgmxdotnet