Age

There's no legal definition of "Single Malt Scotch Whisky", only of "Scotch Whisky", and I already pointed you at the relevant law. The definition of "Single Malt Scotch Whisky" is made by the industry, and enforced by them (somewhat) collectively as the Scotch Whisky Association.

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While efforts have been made towards codifying the definitions legally, they have not, as far as I know, shown any interest in restricting it in the manner you appear to believe they should. Though they did object to Compass Box's "The Spice Tree" vatted malt, that dispute was over a cooperage technique (barrel inserts of new oak) rather than the wood used. When Compass Box went on to release "Oak Cross", with the same new oak but as heads fitted on traditionally coopered casks rather than as inserts, no protest was made.

I'm talking about the law, which you shouldn't spout off about without actually researching.

Google them yourself.

Reply to
Paul Arthur
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My bad Andy, it's not mandated by law, I was wrong, as Paul so gracefully pointed out with his "bullshit" comment. It seems that it's only tradition and, again as Paul pointed out, there is at least *one* bottling of SMSW that bucks the trend and only uses only new oak. One malt amongst thousands, that is talked about for the very reason that it only uses new wood! I couldn't have been more wrong huh?

Anyway, apologies. I'm learning this stuff as I go along and made a mistake.

Cheers,

Reply to
~misfit~

Well, there's a huge difference between a whisky aged in a sherrycask the traditional way and a sherry FINISHED whisky ;^)

Gunnar From: ~misfit~ Newsgroups: alt.drinks.scotch-whisky Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:05 AM Subject: Re: Age

"New fangled sherry finishes"? Using sherry casks is going back to the roots of SMSW. Shaun

Reply to
Gunnar Thormodsæter

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The misunderstanding was my fault. I wasnt clear in what I actually meant. I know that sherry butts are very old. What I meant by "new fangled" was the finishes we are now getting in P. Ximenez and also the Madeira. Not the actual maturation in traditional sherry barrels, but the "finishes". Alo I meant the finishes in Sauternes, in Chardonnay, in Rum etc, etc. Because of the demand for SMSW, I fear that too many new finishes are being created to satisfy the growing demand for something new. This bubble shall surely burst? I grew up within the whisky industry. My father and mother were managers with Scottish/Newcastle. My father also worked for Grants and my aunt worked for Chivas. Now as liquorist in The Netherlands I am heavlily involved with SMSW. I am booked to do the whisky academy at Bruichladdich next year. I have a small business in presenting SMSW for importers and for other interested parties and I lead whisky tours for Serenity Scotland. In all the years I have been involved ( I am now in my mid 50's) and thats basically my whole life, I have never seen so much new finishes. I should not only have mentioned Sherry. I admit I caused a misunderstanding by that. I still worry when someone at Chieftains Choice tells me that their new expression of a certain SM had a Chardonay lid on the bourbon barrel for the last two years. It makes me sigh.

Respectfully submitted,

Jock

Reply to
Jacues Loofjes

Thanks for the explaination Jock/Jacues. That makes things a lot more clear for me. I've been in the wine indusrty for a large part of my life (in New Zealand) and spent most of my 'tasting' life with wines in general, reds in particular. (Although I always liked a dram, even though most of my contemporaries went for the cognac instead.)

Sadly these days I'm an invalid and, as such have a very limited income. I still have 'expensive tastes' though, from years of training my palette (one job I had I tasted 40 wines a day, every day for years and was paid for it!). Of late I've come to the conclusion that, rather than buy an ultimately unsatisfying bottle of mid-priced red (that needs drinking in an evening or risking oxidation) every few weeks or if I get a windfall, I'm better to save a bit longer and get a SM, which can be sipped and savoured for far longer. I can even have several bottles at once (with varying amounts in the ) if I limit my consumption enough so can have comparative tastings. A far better prospect for me than having a bottle of red wine every few weeks and drinking it with a 'dead palette'. Usually my palette is just awakening toward the end of the bottle of wine.

So, in a lot of ways, I guess I could be considered new to SW. Before I was on welfare I was fairly successfully self-employed and kept a well-stocked home bar with usually 5 or 6 SMs amongst the other spirits/liqueuers and several dozen (closer to a hundred) bottles of wine. However, the SMSWs weren't the focus of my bar/'cellar', the wines were.

BTW, coming from a preference for big red wines (like Australian Shiraz') I find I like SMs with 'big' flavours. My current favourite is Ardbeg 10 y/o, extrordinary value for money in my opinion. Their Uigeadail is also very good, although outside my price range (I diverted funds that I really shouldn't have to try a bottle). Barring a big change in my financial situation I doubt I'm going to be able to experiment much further (why didn't I have medical and/or 'income protection' insurance? One tends to think they're immortal/bulletproof until they find out otherwise). However, as mentioned, I'm quite happy with the Ardbeg 10 y/o. I'll still try other drams if and when I can but I think I've found my 'house single malt'.

Unfortunately I'm not in a big city or, as far as I can ascertain, within a reasonable distance of a club where I could pay $x and try several SMSWs. :-(

Again, thanks for explaining things to me in a pleasant and patient manner. I appreciate it very much.

Regards,

Reply to
~misfit~

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You are welcome. My name is Jock. I use jacues as a screen name. My bio is more or less on my scotch and folk page below. We do tastings with a difference. CVabaret style humour and music along with the tastings. It gives peple a good laugh and when you combine facts about destilling along with an emotion like laughter, the facts tend to stick in their heads better. The music side also helps us get booked by casting agencies that do Scottish theme nights with big companies. Even now that we are in recession, I havnt noticed any dip in my bookings. SMSW had an 8% larger turnover in The Netherlands over the past year than the year before. The year before that it was 20% more. But as I said before, the bubble surely will burst. I have come full circle in my tasting preferences. Once my pallate was able to take an Ardbeg with its large PPM, I thought it was the bees knees. Now I love a Speyside dram. I am particularly fond of Glenlivet Nadurra and The Balvenie Single Barrel. My favourite Islay tipple is Bruichladdich at the moment, but that could change. My wife and I are going to the Islay Whisky and Music Festival on the 23rd of May this year. I plan on visiting all destilleries. We have a cottage rented for 2 weeks, so I have the time. And the ceilidh's at night will help me dance off the effects of the drams consumed:-)

I am sorry to hear of your misfortune. I thik its sensible to buy a SM which you like and not have to worry about the effect of oxygen in the bottle unless its open for a very long time. If you like the peat of Ardbeg, may I suggest the Bruichladdich Peat? Not any more expensive than Ardbeg 10 where I live anyway. And more balanced in my opinion. Ardbeg is very hyped. ( this is like cussing in church to some people:-).

You could try

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Its in Wellington and I dont know if thats far away from you. The Single Malt Society may have a club near you. A quick google might help.

You are very welcome.

Respectfully submitted,

Jock Shaw Arnhem. The Netherlands

Reply to
Jacues Loofjes

Yes, a fact being exploited by some of the better schools.

Cool.

During times of recession/depression a lot of folks turn to alcohol. Let's just hope that some of them have the good taste to frequent your establishment.

I am so jealous! I really hope you have a great time, as I know you will.

Ironically I used to drink Glenlivet 'back in the day' as my house dram, sometimes trying others but invariably going back to the 'Livet. These days I only have one or two drams at a time as a rule and one of the things I like about Ardbeg is the PPM of phenols, the fact that I can still taste it

30 minutes after I've put the cork back in.

Thank you for the recommendation, I will surely look out for it. As mentioned, I'm in a fairly small town with a few franchised liquor store branches who all seem to carry the same 10 or so SMs. I've asked in some of them if they know of any clubs or if they sponsor any SM tastings and they look at me like I'm rabid. None of them stock Bruichladdich Peat but if I find myself travelling *and* flush I'll surely take your advice. Thank you. Hopefully the price is similar to the Ardbeg here as, frankly, I'm amazed at how relatively inexpensive Ardbeg is here compared with Laphroaig, Bowmore etc. all of which are over the NZ$100 price-point for their entry-level expresions. Compared to Ardbeg 10y/o at $73 and 'cask strength', (or at least not watered to 40%) it's a hard call when money's tight.

Heathen! As member 389660 of the Ardbeg committee (and as someone who is semi-seriously considering getting the Ardbeg 'A' tattooed on my body somewhere) I take offence to that! (Just kidding, at least about the taking of offence, )

Honestly, up until 6 months ago I had no intention of spending any of what little money I get on SM. Then, one day I bought a bottle of 'Black Grouse' blended whisky and picked up on the peaty/smoky phenols and enjoyed them. The bottle said that it was a mix of The Famous Grouse with "Islay malt whiskies". Coincidently to this, in another newsgroup to which I subscribe a couple of people whom I respect (and one of whom I've met several times) were often talking about catching up for a few drams of Laphroaig.

I hit the internet, found out that the SMs with the highest PPM of phenols were all Islay malts, Ardbeg, Laphroaig and Lagavulin so did the rounds of my local liquor outlets on my birthday when I'd been given some money (supposed to help pay of bills... Shhh!). None of the local stores carry Lagavulin but there are several expressions from Laphroaig and a couple from Ardbeg available. As, like much of my life these days, money rules, I first chose an Ardbeg 10y/o as it cost NZ$73 as opposed to the Laphroaig 10y/o which is NZ$110. (I would have prefered to try the Laphroaig as it's what my friend drinks but the price was too high at the time.)

Subsequent to that I've bough a couple cheaper SMs as foils to the Ardbeg, Glenfiddich and Glenlivet, both 12y/o and both NZ$10 - 15 cheaper than the Ardbeg 10. I also bought an Ardbeg Uigeadail one day when I threw caution (and my weekly food budget) to the winds (NZ$113). It was not long after receiving my confirmation of membership in the Ardbeg committee in the mail (actually only a few hours) so I'm thinking that their committee is, if nothing else, an excellent marketing tool.

Thanks for that. Unfortunately Wellington is a 5 hour drive away. I'm closer to Auckland but haven't had much luck Googling anything up. Mind you, I didn't find the page you did so perhaps I need to hone my Googling skills. The biggest problem I see with having to travel to a tasting is getting home again safely and legally. I'd likely have to call in a favour to find a sober driver yet most all the people I know would rather partake in the tasting also if I could find one. :-/

I appreciate your input Jock, thanks again.

Regards,

Reply to
~misfit~

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Note I did say Glenlivet NADURRA. Its really something else. Very ginger like and I love ginger.

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Strange. Where I live Ardbeg is slightly more expensive than Laphroaigh. Bruichladdich is decently priced.

Well if you want it tatooed on your body ( I hate to think of which part:-) it really is more hyped than I thought. LOL.

Yup. Thats the way many people get started. Or maybe at a nosing and tasting.

Usually people work their way up to the ones with a high PPM. As I said, I seem to have come full circle. I love a decent Speyside now. I have also come to appreciate an easy going Royal Brackla. At cask strength, Royal Brackla is wonderfull. You wouldnt even notice it was cask strength.

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Its strange that I can get that page right from here in The Netherlands. I will copy and paste it for you here:

[22 Allen Street, Wellington Central Cost $30 BOOK ACCOMMODATIONSee Accommodation Guide Whisky Tasting Club

Over the past six months, The Cavern Club has worked hard to establish Wellington's finest single malt selection and beers to match.

To celebrate this, they kindly invite you to their whisky tasting club. Featuring a large proportion of non chill filtered, uncoloured, cask strength single malts, their selection includes rarities such as Balblair 33y.o. , Douglas Laing & Co. Old Malt Cask Ardbeg 15.y.o. , Connoisseurs Choice Port Ellen 1982 and many more.

For $30 per person they invite you to taste: Laphroaig 10y.o. Original Cask Strength (Islay), Mackillop's Choice Rosebank 1990 (Lowland), Bruichladdich "Waves" (Islay), Murray McDavid Glendullan 1996 (Speyside) ]

I hope this helps somewhat and I hope you can find someone to drive you.

Peace,

Jock

Reply to
Jacues Loofjes

Hmmm, haven't tried the Nadurra, must seek knowledge.....

I'm wondering if Ardbeg is new to the New Zealand market and, as such is at "introductory" prices for now?

Hehee! I like ink but hate the cliches. I've been wanting a new tattoo for a while but won't be able to afford a complex one. T'was a passing idea, not really serious....

Cheers,

Reply to
~misfit~

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