I'm going to London which pub should I visit?

It is NOT full of formaldehyde! Will you Brits stop saying that about every beer your mate told you made him crazy? It's your MATE, not formaldehyde in the beer! Jesus... Half the British travel books/websites on travel in Thailand say that about Singha like it was gospel; it's just that it's hoppy and 6% alcohol, and you're not used to it. Sorry, Jeff, but this is a red button for me. There is no formaldehyde in modern beers, outside of a very few locally distributed beers in China. That's it!

Unless...were you just kidding?

Yeah, why can't Brits brew decent lager beer? Is it an unconscious rebellion?

Yeah, it's pretty good.

Not exactly "full of" but relatively high levels.

In this case the mate of 20 years who told me about (I freely admit to knowing bugger all biochemistry) it is a pro brewer, graduate of Heriot Watt

Well, that doesn't make it much better. I don't want my mate, or anyone, in my beer.

(Sorry, it had to be done.)

JW Lees actually do a pretty decent contract brew of Holsten (I think it's the export). It is possible. Just as it's possible for West Coast breweries to do a decent lager. Just doesn't seem to be very common.

-Steve

Brits and lagers....aren't the general population of lager drinkers quite satisfied with Carling and Stella Artois? And maybe the odd Tennant's? I say, let them continue to concentrate on real ales and even....the ones I can get a hold of in the US. Youngs, St. Peters, Sam Smiths, Wynchwood...etc.

Hehe....we're the guys that can do it ALL, after all.

Best regards, Bill

Yeah, I'll think about it, if your mate actually says he put formaldehyde in Stella, and why. Then I'll think about it. Until then, I say bullshit.

My understanding of it (feel free to contradict me or fill in the details from an educated POV everyone) is that formaldehyde is a higher alcohol which is a natural (though undesirable) product of fermentation. The peculiarity of the UK Stella recipe (formuala?) coupled with an inadequate lagering of 4 days imbues Stella with an unusually high level.

The next bit is conjecture - many experienced drinkers observe that consumption of Stella makes them feel rowdy and gives them a buzzing instant hangover-type headache in the frontal lobe. Putting aside the possibilty of some sociological hysteria phenomenon, is formaldehyde the culprit? I've heard this conversation from pro-brewers and various other industry figures (a group in which I include myself at the fairly lowly status of bar owner).

p.s. Looking forward the quips about Stella drinkers and lobotomies.

I think you're confusing it with Acetaldehyde, which is a fermentation product.

Bill Coleman

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Hello!

Formaldehyde is no alcohol but an aldehyde and not a higher one, just the lowest one. Take a look at

Regards and Prost,

Bastian (Chemistry student)

You mean equivalent as in formaldehyde=methanol?

Doesn't the breakdown of sugars by yeast has methanol as byproduct? Or doesn't it work like that? I mean the breakdown of sugars results in a high percentage of ethanol and a small amount of propanol and methanol.

Cheers, Tjander

Small amounts of formaldehyde are actually added in the brewing process in some small breweries in China. It's not produced in fermentation. There is a purpose, odd though it may seem to add a carcinogen to beer...and it's a questionable call. But no non-Asian brewery does it.

Here, check these out:

Since I firmly believe that there isn't any formaldehyde IN Stella...I would doubt it. I've heard the same thing about Bud (and heard people attribute it to "beechwood oil"), Schaefer (which some of my older friends still refer to as "headache beer"), and San Miguel (which also is believed to have formaldehyde in it). These Stella drinkers of yours...are they basing this on one experience? If so, that's a pretty low certainty level. If not...why the hell do they keep drinking it?

It sounds to me like you're getting formaldehyde confused with a couple natural fermentation byproducts: acetaldehyde and fusel alcohols. Both can result from quick fermentations, etc. And both can cause headaches, more potent hangovers, etc.

Formaldehyde never occurs as a natural result of fermentation.

-Steve

I'm more than familiar with acetaldehyde - it very common in dodgy real-ale pubs.

I'll get on to my mate who used to brew Stella for his POV. Sadly he's a bit internet-shy.

JP

Hi Tjander,

No, that was not what I meant. I thought quite a time which word to use but as it turned out equivalent is the wrong one. I was referring to the number of Carbon-atoms in the molecule. Formaldehyde (CH2O) has the same amount like methanol (CH3OH) , Acetaldehyd (C2H4O) the same amount like ethanol (C2H5OH)..

I am not an expert, but I would say that is quite correct. The so called "Fuselöle" are higher alcohols than Ethanol (more than 2 C-atoms). As they get more hydrophob the more C-atoms they have, they make a part of the oily film you see above the liquid if you shake a glass of bad distilled schnaps.

In generally, aldehydes are the first oxidation products of alcohols, the second are the according acids. (Methanol-formaldehyd-formic acid;ethanol-acetaldehyde-acetic acid)

May be in the "Urban Myth" category, but I've heard that acetaldehyde is a precursor of formaldehyde. Acetaldehyde than gets converted to formaldehyde by the temperature of your body when you drink the beer. The _only_ thing that makes me give this ant credence whatsoever is that back in the days when I drank Bud (high in acetaldehyde), just one would give a splitting headache. Ever heard this? Any truth to the acetaldehyde to formaldehyde link?

----------->Denny

Acetaldehyde doesn't need to convert to formaldehyde (even if it can) to cause headaches. Even if you don't drink beer with it in there, the buildup of acetaldehyde is a major component of what makes a hangover the fun experience it is (I don't understand all the metabolic processes occur, but its production is a natural part of alcohol consumption). Bud makes it worse because it's adding more to the mix.

-Steve

Thank you, Steve...kinda what I figured.

--------->Denny

It is not, rest easy.

Pierre

I used to work for an exporter in Rochester, NY and the story we heard was that Rev. Moon would start those rumors so that when he starting shipping in Genesee beer to Indonesia, the locals would gladly pay a few cents more for PURE American beer.

I learned also that he had paid off the Schaefer brewmasters in Baltimore and Brooklyn to put something in the beer to cause headaches. Don't know if it true but certainly Schaefer was a BIG beer in upstate NY, especially when the Albany brewery was making it but, after that, all you heard about was was the headache.

(I'd heard the mafia, which owned a couple of competitor brands, tried to retaliate by paying off a Genny brewmaster to add hops to the recipes of Genny Cream Ale and 12 Horse Ale but they could never get it done...)