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Hello everyone. I'm looking to purchase a few 2003 wines to cellar for the long haul. I'd like bottles to drink on my 10, 25, and 50 year anniversaries. I was looking at some Bordeaux barrel ratings, but I'm not sure which will hold up (especially until 2028 and 2053). Any suggestions? Any idea when these wines will be available? Any idea on pricing? Thanks in advance.
Many 2003 Bordeaux have had good ratings in "Decanter". Mind you, you will pay a big price for wines you want to be around in 50 years or so.
Ron Lel
Look towards first growth Bordeaux --- I personally prefer Ch. Margaux. They are definitely pricey on futures. First run was $225, 2nd run is more than $400 (retail in Alabama). An alternative may be Piedmont wines such as Barolo although the big vintage there was 2000, not 2003.
Did I miss something? How old are you now?
M.
I'm 27, Michael. I'm looking for wines to drink on my 10-, 25-, and
50-year *wedding* anniversaries.
I know all about wine-searcher. I was hoping someone had opinions about particular bottles that will stand the test of time (particularly for 50 years). I was hoping for a list of wines that might be appropriate, along with an idea as to when they would be available. Approximate prices would be a nice, but not entirely necessary addition.
Well Ken, assuming that this is a serious query per appearances, you might find over those many years that your best purchases for the long haul would be wines bought, not untasted from turn-key recommendations by experts you have not met, but rather wines you yourself genuinely enjoy. Many serious
2003 reds with aging potential will appear on the market in (for the northern-hemisphere growing regions for example) 2005 or early 2006. I hope you will not preclude wines outside Bordeaux, for to do that would exclude many very good-value prospects. (Especially because if there is one class of wines that large numbers of people buy on command today, thus inflating the price, because they read and follow the same advice, deny it though they will, that's Bordeaux.) At least for other regions, there should be time to taste some of those 2003's in bottle without inordinate risk of price inflation.Anyway, if you are going to have some emotional ownership of the wines in which you invest seriously for the long term, I believe it will pay well to spend some time getting to know styles and what you like. (To really develop this will take a long time, and you may find that what you appreciate deeply in, say, 25 years, having gained experience not just with wines but with how they age, will be different from what you would appreciate now, but even more different from what you'd end up with had you followed advice now without any such appreciation or buy-in.)
Moreover, within 25 years (if experience is any guide), unprecedented new advice sources promising to short-cut this long learning process will have appeared on the wine scene. Newbies arriving thereafter will flock uncritically to the new sources, not imagining a world without them, indeed will celebrate them as founts of enlightenment. Sharp producers may even play to the new fashion in order to move their merchandise. Old fashionable advisors of 2004 or 2006 will be long forgotten; what was très hip in wines back then will elicit blank stares from the new enthusiasts, who nevertheless are confident of the inside track. (With luck, you'll get a query from someone who wants to buy for the long haul, and then you can share the benefit of your experience, for what it's worth.)
All the more reason to develop your own tastes and buy what you
-- Max
Agghh, wrote extremely long reply then lost dsl connection! A briefer note. A few thoughts (there are exceptions to almost every point below), expanding upon others' good advice:
1) It's indeed good to remember that you're buying for your palate, not a critic's. It's also good to remember that your tastes might change, so a bit of diversity might not be bad idea. 2) Most 2003 reds are still in barrel, so any opinions you read are barrel samples, inherently less exact. 3) When in doubt, go with history. If I was buying for 50 years past vintage, Port (if declared vintage) is most likely to last (I won't get into Maderia). 4) Next best bets: top Bordeaux, Barolos, Loire sweets, German desserts, northern Rhone reds, top Riojas. All good bets for 25 and *maybe* 50. 5) I'd personally rather go for 10-25 than 50:GC & top 1er cru Burgs (red or white)*, southern Rhones, CalCabs, Barbaresco, lower pradikat Germans, Alsace and Austrian Rieslings, Brunello, sec & demi-sec Loires, etc. 6) with the heatwave of 2003, most European areas are reporting an atypical vintage. Hot usually means more ripeness (and less acid). For me, I don't like trying to long-term cellar very fat wines, I prefer an acidic backbone. Some knowledgeable critics disagree. But for me, I'd be careful of wines that are very fat/low-acid. 7) Similarly, I tend to trust methods with long history of longevity to more modern/international styles. So, if they fit your tastes, you might want to consider more traditional producers. So Giacosa, either Mascarello, or Marcarini over say Scavino or Prunotto; Sociando-Mallet or Chasse-Spleen as (much less expensive) alternatives to Pavie. 8)Storage makes a huge difference. No wine will make 50 (or 25) with substandard storage.Good luck. The only hopefully cellarable 2003 I bought so far was Leoville-Barton (which got good reviews from both ends of the critical spectrum, Decanter/J. Robinson and RP). I also bought some cru b/lesser growths that I always buy (Gloria, du Tertre) just because prices seemed fair and I had a little extra. But in general 2003 seemed like a Bordeaux vintage to taste before buying. Dale
Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply
Hello everyone. I'm looking to purchase a few 2003 wines to cellar for the long haul. I'd like bottles to drink on my 10, 25, and 50 year anniversaries. I was looking at some Bordeaux barrel ratings, but I'm not sure which will hold up (especially until 2028 and 2053). Did I miss something? How old are you now? I'm 27, Michael. I'm looking for wines to drink on my 10-, 25-, and
50-year *wedding* anniversaries. re Any suggestions? Any idea when these wines will be available? Any idea on pricing?--------------080904060908030400010908--
For a 50 anniversary, you wil need a fortified and/or a sweet wine. Have a look at
Ken, One of the problems with this question (as Dale mentioned) is that barrel samples are notoriously hard to extrapolate from, especially in matters of longevity -- and that's all we've got to work with, certainly chatter about the '03 Pavie on other web-based boards notwithstanding. Another potential problem is that 2003 was a very unusual vintage with record heat. While some critics (read Robert Parker) have waxed ecstatic over the wines, others have held up flags of caution about their aging potential because of potential lack of balance. So, having said that, I'd look for the usual suspects for very long-term aging: Latour (if you can afford it) or Montrose. They'll certainly make it 25 years if properly stored, but 50 will require immaculate storage and good luck. If '03 is a declared vintage in Port, it would be a better bet IMO for 50 year longevity. And then there's Sauternes... Most quality Bordeaux will be able to make it 10 years, and many of the top wines of the vintage will go 25.
HTH Mark Lipton
Actually, that's one I neglected. Despite the heat, the "word" is the 2003 Sauternes are excellent, with good acidity. Well-stored Sauternes is a good bet for longevity. Thanks Mark.
Dale
Dale Williams Drop "damnspam" to reply
Which probably is the very best bet ommitting fortified wines for
2003.M.
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Thanks for all the helpful replies. I'm not sure why anyone would take my post as anything other than "serious," but...
Storage is not a concern. I took the advice of many here and bought a Eurocave last year! :-) I am not a newbie by any means and understand that I should buy something that suits my taste, but the 50-year longevity was what concerned me the most. I figured 10- and 25- year wines would be easy to find, but ones that will hold 50 left me puzzled. I prefer Burgundy, Oregon Pinots, Port, and many Cab-based blends.
Most of the wines I really like won't last 50 years, and I know that. Most $15-75 bottles won't and that's my usual comfort level. My knowledge of those above that level is very limited. Barolo, Sauternes, and top level Bordeaux came to mind, but I have little experience with most of these. I've never bought First Growth Bordeaux (I've always stuck with Lynch-Bages and a few others--at least until the recent price hikes!), so I was hoping for opinions on them.
I know barrel samples are a difficult animal, but I figured some of you would better understand them than I do. Port is a favorite of mine (I've had experience with the '77), and I also thought about vintage port, but was unsure if 2003 would be declared. Any idea when that determination will be made? Any comments on its longevity? Some vintage ports hold up very well, but others are bound to fall apart, so I don't know if Port is a guarantee either.
Hopefully this clears things up a bit. I appreciate all the help.
Ken, I regularly buy Lynch-Bages (I have a vertical going back to 1982 now) and do not think that it would be a candidate for 50 years. The really great vintages (82,89,2000,2003?) will keep in the 20-25 range but I think that that's going to the limit. Even most of the first growths, except in those really outstanding years, are hard pressed to go 50 years.
Dale and Mark recommended Sauternes, which I had not thought of, but 2003 looks like a fantastic vintage there and they will definitely go the distance. Ch. Rieussec is one of my favorites, but it seems harder to find this year and is much more expensive that in the past.
My wife also loves Barolos, and some of the upper end of these could possibly hold on, but I'm not sure. I've never seen any older vintage Barolos to try and have an opinion (anyone out there that can give me some feedback on that?)
Good luck! Gary
Gary, The question of how far L-B can go will of course depend on your taste, as not everyone considers a fully mature claret in its twilight years to still be "good." Having said that, though, I am faily sure that in most great years L-B will easily go beyond 25 years if properly stored. For instance, we opened a '61 L-B in 2001 and it was still splendid, though quite mature and probably on its downslope. Your point that few Bd'x will make it to 50 in good condition I certainly agree with, though.
Mark Lipton
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