One in four adults 'has a problem with drink'

Alcohol is not drunk for the taste. It is drunk for the effects. After one recognizes the effects, one may develop a taste for various alcoholic beverages, but the primary purpose for drinking alcohol is the high.

-Pete Zakel ( snipped-for-privacy@seeheader.nospam)

Paul's Law: You can't fall off the floor.

You are still confused. People like alcoholic beverages because those beverages contain alcohol and they develop the taste for them after experiencing the effects. Very few people like the taste of alcoholic beverages the very first time they try them.

Similarly with coffee and tea, which are drunk for the caffeine.

Also, cannabis perparations vary in taste as well.

-Pete Zakel ( snipped-for-privacy@seeheader.nospam)

"Craig Shergold is a 10 year old boy who is dying of cancer. Before he dies, he would like to set the world record for receiving the most Neiman-Marcus Cookie Recipes. You can help Craig by sending an irate fax to LEXIS-NEXIS demanding that they remove all traces of your mother's maiden name from their executive washroom wall. They will respond by sending e-mail labeled `Good Times' to the computer controlling Craig's life support equipment. When Felippe Linz, the technician operating the computer opens this mail, his hard drive will be overwritten with thousands of credit card invoices for $250.00, erasing the last bit of evidence that Hillary was seen on the grassy knoll when JFK was shot, thus allowing world domination by Bill Gates, and his tri-lateral commission cronies who are eating fried peanut butter and banana sandwiches in the black helicopters with Elvis."

Coffee and tea.

-Pete Zakel ( snipped-for-privacy@seeheader.nospam)

Scotty: Captain, we din' can reference it! Kirk: Analysis, Mr. Spock? Spock: Captain, it doesn't appear in the symbol table. Kirk: Then it's of external origin? Spock: Affirmative. Kirk: Mr. Sulu, go to pass two. Sulu: Aye aye, sir, going to pass two.

Chocolate, tea, coffee.

Well, the "boozers" that I know do more than =pretend= to be selective. They spend an order of magnitude more on certain wines than on other wines which would have the same intoxicating effect, so either they are so boozed up they can't count any more, or they actually value the flavor much more than the buzz.

They also don't drink enough to get intoxicated, though they do seem to be very selective as to which wine to drink, and would often forgo wine (and other intoxicants) should the wine of choice not be available.

Ok, I did know some people who claimed to like tobacco for the flavor. I never understood that (since it dulls the palate), but I won't disupte it. But the extent of that was to have a single favorite brand, not to have a different favorite for different circumstances. Hardly a gustatory choice.

I'd say it's a hard case to make that those substances are drugs (except tobacco)

social access for

Perhaps. But would people consume those substances BECAUSE of the taste? I suspect not. It can be reasonably argued (not that I'd agree, just that agreement would not be unreasonable) that mixed drinks are consumed primarily for the intoxicating effect, and that the various flavorings make them more palatable. In this sense your comment about "quality testing" and "variety-comparison" of those substances might have merit.

Wine, however, is different in that respect, because of the reasons wine (other than two buck chuck perhaps) gets consumed.

This will be my last post on the subject, since I am more interested in the taste than the politics (although the question does have merit and interest if not approached as a troll). I'm on alt.food.wine, and don't frequent the other two crossposted groups (uk.politics.drugs and talk.politics.drugs) since my interest in those topics is not sufficient.

Jose

Salut/Hi Jasbird,

le/on Sat, 14 Jan 2006 01:07:07 GMT, tu disais/you said:-

You cross posted it.

In any case, anyone who posts an article from the Daily Mail deserves to be killfiled immediately.

No, boozing to excess does. Anyway, IMO your intent was clearly to cause controversy and that - as Hunt said, merits killfiling. So - bye-bye

Ian

Although cigarette smokers tend to stick to one brand, many pipe and cigar smokers enjoy varied tobacco blends.

-Pete Zakel ( snipped-for-privacy@seeheader.nospam)

"If I don't drive around the park, I'm pretty sure to make my mark. If I'm in bed each night by ten, I may get back my looks again. If I abstain from fun and such, I'll probably amount to much; But I shall stay the way I am, Because I do not give a damn."

-Dorothy Parker

isn't that nice. how can i ensure that the person to whom i reply sees my reply unless i post to the same groups that appear in their message?

you can try something really simple: *don't read* posts that you have no interest in.

works every time.

b

When someone has to convince others that something obvious is indeed something else altogether - like a boozer trying to convince folks that he drinks because of the flavour of his chosen booze - one must spend an inordinate amount of time and effort show and telling, else folks just will not believe the claim. In truth, the selection is merely the one that tastes less bad to the imbiber, than do other alcohol mixtures he or she has tried.

=======

"Intoxicated" is not necessarily falling down drunk. Even small amounts of alcohol will toxify brain cells enough to give sensory feedback. While these people claim to not drink for the high, in fact they simply settle for a lesser high than fall down drunks.

Deciding to forgo such a small high in favour of impressing friends and family with the boozers ability to ration and even go without, lends enormous credibility to the claim that one only drinks for the flavour. As I said, enourmous efforts must be made by the addict to assure his friends he is not an addict.

======

But it ends up with the exact same result as with alcohol, because the exact same social dillemna has to be over come. The message: An Addict is NOT someone who only partakes for the flavour.

=======

Only if you do not want to think of them as drugs. They are drugs however, whether you deem them so or not. :)

=======

allowed social access for

They would no more consume the substances due to the flavour than do alcoholics. As I said at the beginning, the love of flavour for boozers is a social acceptance act. The love of flavours among cocaine and heroin users (were their fix flavoured and orally taken) would also be merely an act. That would not prevent them, like all of the booze comparison clubs, from pretending to be flavour junkies in public whenever possible.

=====

No its not. Wine definitely tastes better than most booze, but is still a shitty tasting liquid - gods man, its putrefied fruit. Wine is merely another alcoholic beverage with the exact same problems as all other alcoholic beverages. The fact that it has gained a socially acceptable niche is due entirely to the fact that we have been doing the social pretense for wine for millenia.

Wine has been around so long that addicts had to actually create Wine Tasting events in order to hammer home the Flavour Love myth. It is now institutionalized as part of society. To be a Wine Flavour Junky is to be considered as part of the upper crust of society in fact.

In my opinion only of course. :)

====

I'll leave the link on this post but will try and remove them for the wine group in future.

Have a great life.

GEM

alt.food.wine is a sea of serenity compared to flame wars you see on other sites like alt.headbangers.ouch, you're wasting your time not deleting our group before hitting "send"

It's the snob value - like Havana cigars. I get about as much pleasure from a glass of beer as I do from the finest wine or whisky I've ever tasted. Unfortunately I'm not a snob.

social access for

how can i reply to you if i delete the group you post from?

now i'm frightened.

b

I think he means Cheech, Chong and Bong.

Note that I don't try to say I drink alcoholic beverages for the flavor -- I

*like* the buzz, and I can feel the buzz off of just one drink (it is subtle, but I can definitely feel it).

But I am selective about what I drink. I prefer red and amber ales and good lagers (and a few dark ales) for my brews. I don't like bitter ales. I like good wines, and prefer sweet whites (preferably German Mosel or Rhine wines -- most California sweet wines are too complex) and smooth reds (Zinfandels, Pinot Noirs and Merlots mostly -- I find Cabs too tannic, but I've had a few Cabs I like). And I like *good* brandy (I'm currently slowly working on a bottle of Hennessey VSOP), unless I'm adding it to eggnog, in which case I use the better cheap brandies. And I like Jaegermeister. I also like gin'n'tonic (preferably Bombay Sapphire) and gin gimlets.

I don't drink often or much because I have to be kind to my liver (HCV).

And I like alcoholic beverages because they have alcohol. I almost never drink virgin cocktails or alcohol free wine or beer because if I'm going to drink something without alcohol I'd rather drink coffee (I do like Irish coffee and coffee with Bailey's, of course), Pepsi or fruit juice. Or just plain water.

-Pete Zakel ( snipped-for-privacy@seeheader.nospam)

It seemed to me, and still does, that the system of American business often produces wrong, immoral and irresponsible decisions, even though the personal morality of the people running the businesses is often above reproach.

-- John Z. DeLorean, 1979