Tasting Notes--First Posting

Bill Hogsett wrote in news:Xns95D8579BEBE5Bbhogsettwowwaycom@216.196.97.142:

This sounds like possible TCA- did the first wine have a musty wet cardboard taste? It doesn't always come out that way to me, the first thing I notice is the lacking- no fruit dull taste are good signs of a bad situation. Even poor (cheap)wine will usually show some varietal character (think about the $6 cabs that they taste at the supermarket, one can usually at least know that the wine is meant to be cabernet s even if it isn't a great one), when varietal character is missing, something is wrong and corked bottle is a likely contender.

"Bill Hogsett" skrev i melding news:Xns95D8579BEBE5Bbhogsettwowwaycom@216.196.97.142...

Nice to hear about your tastings. Your low rating of the Argento Malbec surprised me a little, so it may have been an off bottle, especially judging from your statement "no fruit". It could have been TCA contamination you know. This Malbec was considered a very good buy for the very low price, around here. Now, there certainly are much better Malbecs around and I'll have to look for this Terrazas de los Andes... :-) Catena Alta 2000 seems to be the best I can get in Norway (55USD a bottle) Anders

Thanks for the post and reviews. I used to live in Chagrin Falls and now I live outside of Columbus so we're practically neighbors! Please deep posting you notes I enjoyed them. Bi!!

In article , snipped-for-privacy@wowway.com says... [SNIP]

Thanks for the TNs - always appreciated. I'm a bit surprised at the Kim Crawford SB. I have some of the 04, but have not opened one yet. Unfortunately (maybe) I gave three as gifts, when I ran out of the three cases of Hafner. In most other years the Crawford has proved to be great value, sort of a poor man's Cloudy Bay. I'll crack an 04 this evening and put it to the test, especially if I'm going to gift it! Crawford has, in the past, offered me layers of flavor and a wonderful experience. It has exhibited great NZ SB character and offered inexpensive pleasures. Maybe St H can shed light on the

Again, thank you for the contribution, Hunt

jcoulter wrote in news:Xns95D859C27AB56225stellar@216.196.97.136:

No, I didn't identify a "musty wet cardboard taste." More no taste at all. But, since I don't think I have ever identified a TCA corked bottle, I am not sure what to describe. But, "musty wet cardboard taste" sure sounds unappealing.

Bill Hogsett

"Bill Hogsett" skrev i melding news:Xns95D8730556758bhogsettwowwaycom@216.196.97.142...

Hi Bill Did you ask your wife? You see, you might be like me - I think I'm quite insensitive to TCA and so don't often, if ever, get that musty wet cardboard sensation. But, I've certainly had wines with little or no fruit (flat, empty, nothing there) which is a telltale sign for TCA insensitives I've understood. Anders.

Hi Bill,

I agree, this is a very enjoyable ng (unless we get involved in a discussion with a crosspost) then a few of the "other folk" start emerging from under their rocks ;-)

Your bravery (first official post) might get some of us other lurkers to venture into a tasting note or two. The experienced regular posters are usually very supportive of us who are trying to learn more about wine.

All the best,

Larry Southern Ontario

snipped-for-privacy@hunt.com (Hunt) wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news3.newsguy.com:

I'll be interested in your opinion of the 04. It may very well be that I haven't had enough New Zealand sauvignon blanc to judge what is good and what is not. But, I didn't find the Kim Crawford (Marlborough) to be very interesting.

Bill Hogsett

I've always been somewhat quizzical about the fans of NZ sauvignon blanc. The wine is very respected and regularly gets high ratings in tastings, yet the relatively common descriptor that the tasters use is "cat pee". Frankly, that isn't high on my list of potential flavor favorites--although I must confess to having little experience first-hand. The end result is that my experience with NZ SB has been limited and the wines I've tried weren't high on my list. I've done the Cloudy Bay thing as well as a number of Marlboroughs and it just didn't float my boat.

In SB, I've always found two distinct flavor profiles. One is a bright, tart, fruit group--you'll hear of citrus, kiwi, etc. The other is more mineral--things like flint, stoniness, etc. My usual preference is for the flinty form. I'd rather find the tart fruit profiles in whites of Italy, Alsace, Spain, etc.

But, that's just my opinion. Ed Rasimus Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret) "When Thunder Rolled"

"Hunt" wrote (re Kim Crawford Sauvignon Blanc) ..........

I have previously posted on the sheer size of the 04 vintage (in particular respect to the Marlborough region) it was/is nearly double the previous year.

But (and there is always a but!) I do not equate size with quality - I fear that many wineries (particularly those with larger export markets) have churned out one hell of a lot of wine (by NZ standards, of course) of good, but not excellent quality.

I myself *am not* a huge Kim Crawford fan - it has wide availability in every supermarket chain around, is frequently discounted - and to me, is exactly what the British market demands, a quite aggressive, one dimensional style of Marlborough SB.

I have tried the 04 on about 1/2 dozen occasions, and remain underwhelmed.

Firstly, I understand that although there are something like 150 separate Marlborough Sauvignons made, many are made in very small quantities, and to you USAns, I am sorry, the UK market remains far more important to NZ winemakers than yours (your "difficult" distribution system is an impediment to the marketing of "boutique" wines) - so, while there are quite a few better examples of NZ Sauvignon which I have tried, I can only guess which ones may be available.

Getting back on to the subject of Kim Crawford SB - imnsho, it would not make my top 20.

Top 2004 Marlborough wine (to me) is Sacred Hill Marlborough SB, followed by Nautilus, Mud Brick (I know this is available in Australia) Jackson Estate, several of the Villa Maria Single Vineyard Reserve wines (Wairau & Clifford) and Cloudy Bay (available under Stelvin, I note!)

I rate the 2004 Palliser Estate (Martinborough) something like 18/20 (not quite up to the astounding 2003).

A word about Cloudy Bay, and the Villa Maria Reserve wines - they are more expensive, but I do believe that these wineries "do more".

Both have a little oak maturation, to soften that acidic assault; some have a little Semillon blended; both pick at various times, to ensure some very ripe fruit introduces some real tropical flavours, while underpinning with typical kiwi sauvignon "herbaceousness"

There ends the gospel according to His Lordship.

I agree with (the privately communicated comments of my friend, the learned Lipton) - upon my recommendation, he tried the Nautilus, and compared same with the Crawford.

The Crawford was OTT (his comment) and harsh (mine) - while the Nautilus showed more complexity (his words) and structure and dimension (mine)

Sauvignon (no matter where from) would not be my choice of winter wine, but, I urge you, to look outside the obvious - you may well be surprised)

Salut/Hi st.helier,

As usual, I agree with most of what you say about NZ Sauvignons,

le/on Sun, 9 Jan 2005 21:27:01 +1300, tu disais/you said:-

Who is missed on the NG (is he OK?)

Assuming you mean "winter" in weather terms, rather than a North-centric set of months, why not, and what would YOU serve to accompany a new recipe I shall be trying out by the ever adventurous Gordon Ramsey, "Jerusalem artichoke risotto with pan seared scallops."

You cook the unpeeled (to preserve their flavour) sliced artichokes in butter till tender and then simmer with cream till well reduced. That's used as the flavouring added at the end of a classic risotto made with chicken stock etc and the richness cut with a dribble of a sweet sherry vinegar caramel. I had been going to use one of my remaining Babich Barrel fermented SBs, but wondered what kind of wine you felt would go better. A classic white Burgundy (with a flavour profile like that Alan Scott Reserve we blew our minds over)? Something more mineral?

I knew that you would come through on this one and THANK you. Over the years (more casual tasting than is required to actually rate the NZ SBs) I've found the Nautilus to be a wonderful wine, often on par, or even slightly above the CB. Unfortunately, the highly rated Palliser doesn't seem to be found in the Sonoran Desert. I have some of the '03 Nautilus, AWS the CB, but will try and find the '04 to taste alongside the aforementioned '04 Crawford.

I, like Ed Rasimus, do not find "cat pee" to be a pleasent taste component, however, I've never encountered it in the NZ SB's that I've had the pleasure to try. The "damp hay, bracing citrus, and other light herb" notes are all there, but I've never found cat pee. Maybe like some, who write that they seem non-sensitive to TCA, I just have a tolerance for it. Having had cats for many years, I have never taken the opportunity to "taste" it, but have cleaned MANY a litter box, and think I know what it smells like. I think that using it as a descriptor in the flavo(u)r profile is a subversive plot by those who love NZ SB's to keep the supply UP :-) Regardless, I'll do a horizontal of the '04s and see what shakes out - hopefully NOT the litter box!

Thanks, Hunt

snipped-for-privacy@hunt.com (Hunt) wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news1.newsguy.com:

but I've never found cat pee.

Just remeber that it (the cat's pee) is a good thing! present in the better Sancerre as well.

I hereby nominate you for further research on that particular attribute. You know, the usual standard verification, validation, certification, etc. Relationships to breeds and size of cats, consistency of flavor, aging for maximization of taste, etc. That sort of thing. I'll stick with flinty, fruity and the occasional fine-grained tannin sort of descriptors. ;-)

Ed Rasimus Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret) "When Thunder Rolled"

Ed,

Are you saying that that research project is "urine?" Sorry, couldn't resist a bit of my "red-neck" humo(u)r. I too do not find that flavor/odor a nice one, however, I do admit that some of the mercaptane [SP?] aromas, that would normally be off-putting elsewhere, do seem pleasent in some wines, same for the "barnyard" aspect in some PNs - in very small does, though.

Hunt

Great post, thank you! I also lurk far mor ethan I post and one of my resolutions this year is to post more to the newsgroup. School has started back up, so postings will likely be few, but I'll take it on myself to try and cover wines on the "cheaper" end of the spectrum.

One question for you, I live in Cleveland (Heights) as well, and would love to know where you shop for wine. I've been here for a year and have not found any places I particularly like to shop for wine (I miss the wine warehouses in the South of Market area of San Francisco). I would love to hear any recommendations, as I'm tired of the supermarket wines.

thank you, K