too few for a 23 litre carboy and too many for the 11 1/2 litre (basis the recipes I've reviewed). I thought maybe I'd add bananas to make up the difference and make the larger carboy. Any thoughts on this idea?
For that matter, I've read banana wine makes a great blending agent to add body to fruit wines. Perhaps incorporating bananas in any fruit wine to begin with might be a good enhancement. Am I on the right track with this thinking?
This one for starters:
Stanley Anderson has a crabapple (only) recipe in his book as well.
I like the idea of supplementing this harvest with other sweet apples. Thanks.
Given that "country wines" tend to be thin and lack complexity I'm surprised to not see more combination recipes (like the banana idea)
-- unless there is something unsound about the practice that I'm not aware of.
Thanks, Jim
Browsing through Jack's recipes, I often see adjuncts in wine... watermelon with grape concentrates/raisins/bananas or something like that... from my few forays into the fruit wine area, the light ones seem to need some body... banana is fairly neutral so that's why it's a favoured addition.
You might try making a cyzer instead of a wine. The honey (mead) character would make up for the apple shortage. Make a straight mead and flavor it with as many apples as you want. The less apples, the more mead character you will get or visa versa.
Ray
Thanks for your contributions everyone. I'm going to add a few litres of organic apple juice (preservative-free) for starters (should I use more?). I'll investigate all suggested ideas before I start.
Check your acid levels closely... Mine were pretty high.
Later, A.J.
I followed Stanley Anderson's recipe for closely. To make up for the shortage of crab apples (basis 23 litres) I added to the must 3 x 909 ml Organic Apple Juice from the Health Food Store (no preservatives added).
After 6 days in the primary there is still no evidence of fermentation. I've added my third packet of Champagne yeast already (EC-1118). Question: What gives? Any ideas?
Temp: 20 degrees C.
Most likely thing is that the "no preservatives added" statement is somewhat exaggerated, or you oversulfited, or your yeast is no good. And apple must should burst into activity after 24 hours at the very most. Check the sulfite levels if you have the proper test kit. Otherwise aerate the must. Then make a yeast starter (check the recent archives at
And get the must temperature up to 25C.
Check your acid levels... I had that problem and found the acid level way too high... I reduced the acid level and it took off.
Thanks fellas for your comments.
Negodki: I've been wondering about sulfite levels too. Anderson's recipe suggested sprinkling a sulfited water solution over apples periodically when cutting them up to keep them from turning brown. I stayed well within his max though. Later, I sanitized the must with a
1/4 tsp sulfite.I received my new titrets kit and excitedly prepared to test when I came to learn that in addition to the ampoules and titretor I also need a valve assembly to draw up the must. So much for testing today. You'd think they woulda known to set me up with complete kit. I've been aerating. Thanks.
A.J.: TA reading is 7.9 g/l. Yes, too high, but is that off the map too high or just not within ideal range. It's odd that Anderson's recipe would call for addition of acid blend to a tart fruit like crab apples. Intuitively I wondered so fortunately I used 2/3 of his recommended addition.
How did you reduce the high acid level in your must? I have CaCO3 kicking around but I didn't know I could use that in the primary. Maybe I should dump in the NaOH solution from my acid testing kit ;-) Of course that's a facetious comment but you'd think there would be a base out there compatible with a wine must that one could use to easily reduce acidity.
TIA
Citric acid (lemon juice) is used for the same purpose, but neither are necessary. I've cut up 36 pounds of apples with an apple slicer and knife without them browning noticeably. But that is also unnecessary. Just put them in a 5-gallon bucket, and pound them butter-churn style with a (clean and sterilized) 4x4 post. Or wrap the post in saran-wrap. Much quicker. And ALWAYS ferment apple on the skins. Gives you the tannin which helps preserve the wine, and (usually) makes it clear on it's own, and tastes better. (Only my opinion of course. :)
Just add sulfite until you can taste it, and then go back in time and add half as much. :)
I've learned recently that there are also "sweet" crab apples!
CaCO3 or K2CO3 are the "preferred" additives for grape wines. I believe both should be added as soon as possible, as that will leave the least amount of noticeable flavour. Acid reduction was discussed in several recent threads. Search the archives at
However, with apples, especially with crab-apples, I strongly recommend dilution with water for acid reduction. Apples have so much flavour that you can press and do a second run (with the pressings) that has almost as rich a flavour as the first. If you haven't yet begun the ferment, add the water and readjust the SG. If you've already begun the ferment, bring the water to your initial SG before adding it to the must. One part water to five parts must will reduce the acidity by about 10% (which would reduced a .79 TA to about .71, which is where you want to be). Although 1:5 is the maximum dilution I would recommend for grapes, you can add more to apples. I add 1 gallon of water to 12 pounds of apples, and the wine is still robust and full-bodied!
I added CaCO3... I have used it before and did not have any problems that I noticed...
A.J. Rawls Anchorage, Alaska, USA
glad heart wrote "I received my new titrets kit and excitedly prepared to test when I came to learn that in addition to the ampoules and titretor I also need a valve assembly to draw up the must. So much for testing today. You'd think they woulda known to set me up with complete kit."
Glad heart - you don't need anything besides the ampoule that comes with the Titret kit. Attach the plastic tube to the ampoule, break the neck and pinch just behind the ball in the plastic neck to draw up wine. Be sure to have the plastic tube beneath the wine surface.
Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas
I just want to say thanks to everyone for your contributions to this thread. Finally got the crab apple / apple must cooking 12 or 13 days ago. It's had a nice cool fermentation and is now ready to be racked into the secondary.
Negodki: your dilution idea worked perfectly. I diluted about 15%, warmed up the must and used a yeast starter. Fired up easily. If it turns out I'll send you a bottle.
Cheers,
Jim
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