Just a last visit

Not entirely sure what that was all about. Gloating of sorts perhaps? I have to agree with him a little bit about the group going downhill. It certainly not as active as it once was.

So long Trevor. Sorry...Can't say I agree with you that r.c.w. has changed that much. Lots of new winemaker questions that could have been avoided if the people had read Lum's, Ben's and Jack' sites or bought a few good books. But it's always been that way. I don't mind answering new winemaker questions but others usually beat me to it. In this late winter season, here in the US, most of us are getting ready for the new grape season and last year's wine is made and some already bottled. So, it's country wine and kit questions. I'm sure you could contribute a lot more with your past experience owing a pub and making many types of country and grape wines. I'll miss your input.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas USA

I'd like to say Thank You to everyone that has answered any of my questions, provided encouragement or steered me in the right direction in the last 1.5 or so years. And also to everyone that has provided forthright help and coveyed thier experiences for the benefit of the archives through the years. The fruit of your assitance is in the glass. CHEERS to you!!

I don't know why people feel they need to flip everyone the bird when they leave an NG. Maybe they image themselves as the reason for the NG, or their ego can peel the life from an NG. Miserable folks love company I suppose. But in my usenet experience those folks ran out of constructive ideas or useful contributions long before the temper tantrum.

Thank you so very much! Steve noobie Oregon

Trevor,

Thank you so much for sharing your opinion of this newsgroup. I'm sure in your absence it will completely fall apart and lose any value whatsoever. You've been such a frequent participant in this forum of late... I count about... ZERO posts by you recently.

I've never understood how someone can become so conceited and self-absorbed that they would think posting a going away message in a Usenet newsgroup would be appropriate.

Regards,

Greg G.

I would agree with that, Bill. Trevor contributed many useful posts on country wines in the past, and I for one will miss that.

Usenet is voluntary and no one has to stay or go beyond what they feel is appropriate. While the posting volume has gone down most of the questions have been asked and answered; if this group is a victim of it's own success that's a good thing. Google has made it very easy to find just about anything on the net, that may have a lot to do with it too.

Very few Usenet groups have been this civilized and this helpful to newbies; I for one see no reason to stop posting.

Joe

f*ck that asshole this group rules.if it was not for you kick ass people i would still be buying my wine.LONG LIVE THIS (NG)

; if this group is a victim of

Hi Joe

I agree. Newbies are the lifes blood of this group. Only when _they_ stop posting will this group die.

Frederick

I will miss Trevor's sage and wit. Sadly, his desire seems to be for having Experts.Craft.Winemaking. When one of us 'newcomers' makes a mistake in what we say, we appreciate the sages chiming in and setting us right. I'd rather make a mistake and learn from it than to sit on my hands and not take a chance. To me, discussions are what makes Rec.Craft.Winemaking a treasure, and every contributor is important.

Gene

William Frazier wrote:

The only thing Pinky posts is goodbye messages ...

&scoring=d&hl=en&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=rec.crafts.winemaking&as_usubject=&enc_author=aqy0UyAAAADwavsFkcrjchynU4ARn0oePN-BUkLwWdjt4QgeSrBFCw&as_uauthors=&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny81&as_maxd&as_maxm=3&as_maxy 06&safe=off

outside of random abuse, that is ...

Seriously Pinky, why all the hostility, there gotta be worse groups out there than our current crop of noobs.

I had to laugh at this guy. Pretty funny self-worth he must have. Maybe he'd make a good guest at a large party where you needed someone to act snob-ish, and bor-ish. heehee.

I have learned a lot in this NG and read EVERY new posting for valuable information, even If I am not taking my wine into Canada (for instance), I learn from all the posts.

DAve

P> My goodness me this NG has gone down hill. It is, however, good to see one

You lot really need to grow up, Trevor is a septogenarian, a very wise, fit (thanks to his cycling), funny and generally nice guy. And on top of that he knows a lot about winemaking. I met him a few months ago, he lives a few miles from me and filled in for the guy who owns the local homebrew shop, so I had the chance to have a long conversation with him. He really does know what he's talking about, easily as much as the Jack (nice internet site) Kellers of this world.

So stop giving the guy a hard time!

Respect your elders.

sorry trevor I omitted 'nearly', as in 'nearly a septogenarian' - you're not quite 70, just a few short months...

Peacelover, I admire the loyalty you show to your friend & neighbor. I can only hope my neighbors and friends will someday be so generous. Trevor pays respect to Tom S and Ray Calvert, and he is right on. Anytime Tom S, Calvert or Lum post a message, I read it. Even if it regards a component of winemaking I have no interest in or knowledge of. Jack Keller is also an expert, however he is far too AWOL. What I really appreciate is how Tom S, Lum and Ray C will frequently respond to the most basic of questions without a hint of frustration or impatience. They are true teachers, and they share their vast knowledge willingly and without reserve. There are so many other contributors in this very same category, Dar V being another who has established a niche for one gallon country wines and who lends a refreshing and kind-hearted approach to our favorite pastime. On the other hand, I frequently found Trevor to be crotchety, self-absorbed and condescending. He used the r.c.w. as his blog, and was far too intolerant of the very backbone of this NG and from which we all evolved: the newbie. I wish him well but won't miss him for a moment.

Paul

Peacelover wrote:

Have you discounted Trevor's true-Brit glibness too much Mr. Paul? Trevor speaks for Traditionalism, and there is a lot such thinking has to offer.... in stability and in comfort of "all that needs to be known about winemaking is already known and only needs to be practiced". And there are those of us who break out of that mold (pardon the moldy pun) and are willing to risk making mistakes in hopes of finding more knowledge. Both are reasonable viewpoints.... both have merit, both have their detractions.... both hold value. Therefore, I believe both are to be held as useful in their own ways. I may disagree with Trevor's staid and Brit ways... but I respect him for his knowledge and integrity. Let us hope Trevor grants us our differences and opens his horizon a bit to tolerance of the differences.

I will miss Trevor if he does really leave r.c.w. Gene

snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Thanks for the kind comments of mike and others and even Trevor. Of course I try to give good advice, especially to nug's. They need it more than the more experienced winemaker who can take what any of us say with a grain of salt and blend it with what they do rather than doing it by wrote. I spent many years making wine with the help of only a few friends like Paul Leamon and for course C.J.J. Berry, though I never met the man. Then I found this group and have truely learned a lot. Much of my advice comes from what I have learned by applying what I picked up here so certainly I should give back.

One of those that I have learned much from it Trevor and I have always apreceiated what he has written in relation to winemaking and I do not mind his being a bit crochety. But I am sorry that he has lost touch with the beginner. I would welcome him back in his old capacity of a few years ago when he was truely helpful. I will miss him. I think what has happended, and he can certainly jump on me if I am wrong, is that he has lost interest in beginners but he stops back by every now and then to see if the group has changed. Of course the goup has not and in my opinion should not so he continues to be dissapointed and can not resist the urge to say so. Hope he changes his mind in the future or he find a proffestional group where he might fit in better.

Ray

could make the group just for experienced winemakers... but i want to thank everyone that helped me last summer when i made my first batch.. lucas