Selling Wine

I know of no other alternative to commerical licenses... but perhaps these people would be interested in pooling resources and learning how to make wine themselves... I have 2 friends that have joined me in making wine and we all go splits on the equipment and grapes. It's worked out well, but we are rather good friends, and kind of related as well, so it's a closer connection.

I've always enteratained the idea of a co-op winery as well... not sure too much on the legality of such an operation but perhaps when I have more capital it will be something I will look into :^)

Technically, it is probably illegal for you to give away homemade wine, depending upon how the Treasury and courts have defined "personal or family use". It is certainly illegal to "trade" it for goods or services (including "favors"). But you are unlikely to be prosecuted unless you offer it for sale, in which case you are almost certain to be prosecuted.

In the US, you cannot obtain a license to sell home made wine

You would have to become a bonded winery, paying all applicable fees, and submitting all applicable paperwork. You would also have to comply with a myriad of regulations (federal and state) dictating how your wine is made, what you put into it, quantity, quality, alcohol level, bottle sizes, and the shape and color of your lables. You would also be required to put inaccurate warning labels on your bottles, reflecting the (politically-motivated) "science" of the day. You would have to collect and pay all the various federal, state, and local "sin" taxes, and you would be precluded from brewing on Sunday in several states.

CORRECT -A-MUNDO !!!!!!!!

I'm going through the process now. You just wouldn't believe the amount of paperwork involved.

One hint though... After you go through all the paperwork life does get easier. Believe it or not it seems the only things the Fed and St agencies are interested in is the tax money. AND (get this) how well your facility is secured. They actually have a regulation for the inspectors regarding the size and type of dead bolts. (Can't have any one stealing that wine before the tax has been paid on it)

Unless you're planning getting serious and producing a few thousand gallons or more a year my advice is forget it. It doesn't make sense to go through all the "bs" to be able to sell a few cases a year.

Nic is right about giving it away. That's a "no-no". The law says for YOUR and your family household members personal consumption. You can't give it away. Just a footnote here.........and ATF agent recently told me that technically you can't even serve it to friends in your home so that rules out parties.

Good Luck

Dave Stacy

The law's not quite that strict, Dave, although the language is deliberately ambiguous:

(f) Removal. Wine produced under this section may be removed from the premises where made for personal or family use including use at organized affairs, exhibitions or competitions, such as home winemaker's contests, tastings or judgings, but may not under any circumstances be sold or offered for sale. (Sec. 201, Pub. L. 85-859, 72 Stat. 1331, as amended (26 U.S.C.

5042))

Since the word "including" is used, there is an implication that there are other permitted "removals" than those listed. One could argue that a party is an "organized affair", or even an "exhibition" or (if it is a fraternity party) a "competition"; or that they are sufficiently similar to be "included" in permitted uses. A hard-nosed Treasury agent or federal justice might interpret it differently. One court has ruled that "in-laws" are not "family" for purposes of this code section. Another has ruled that "family" includes even casual acquaintances. Both are now deceased, and it's anyone's guess how the current circuit court will interpret this (or any) law.

Ain't government regulation fun?

My you have such a poor outlook on our government. The law would not exist if it was not for your benefit. What would happen if thieves stole some of your wine before it was properly aged? That could potentially harm your reputation amongst the thieves and their friends and result in lost sales.

Even the wine ready for sale could be damaged from rough handling in the get-a-way vehicle. They could steal in on a Friday night and serve it at a dinner party on Saturday and it would not taste right after all that shaking around.

The government is looking out for you! Ed

I don't know what state you are from, but in Massachusetts it is virtually impossible for someone to make wine at home for resale. For all the rules and regulations in MA see

I can understand some regulation when it comes to manufacturing and/or selling alcohol, but some of the fees for these licenses are outrageous. I would think the state could raise just as much if not even more money if they just had a $100 annual license fee to sell wine and a penalty of $5000 for getting caught without a license. I and thousands of other amateur winemakers in this state would gladly pay $100 for a license to sell a few batches of homemade wine to the public and local restaurants. The state would accomplish the goal of raising money through licensing and sales taxes, and they would also have control of who is selling and who is buying.

Selling my wine wouldn't necessarily make me rich, but it would be the most gratifying and "funnest" side job I can think of.

You are exactly where I was awhile back. You need to make your wine at a bonded winery, get yourself licensed to sell wine, and pay a bunch of fees and taxes along the way. It's a big pain in the ass, but if you short-circuit the system you put yourself at risk legally.

You'll need a basic permit from the Feds to start with, plus a license from your local ABC. Also, your state Franchise Tax Board gets involved somewhere along the way.

Tom S

Steve,

I couldn't agree more. Unfortunately you and I don't head up the agencies that make those rules.

Imagine how much denero would be raised if there was a license that allowed you to produce and SELL up to 500 gallons a year. I agree if it was $100 to $500 most home winemakers would fork over the cash and potholes in the road outside your home might get fixed with the money.

Oh well, that law doesn't exist so here I wade through the 40 pages of ATF forms that must be filled out in triplicate.

Dave Stacy

Oh now that is just too funny!

Ed, you and I have the same dry sense of humor. I laughed my ass of when I read this.

Thanks for the good chuckle this morning.

Dave Stacy

I wonder if you've ever considered leaving the People's Republic of Massachusetts and moving to sunnier climes in Pennsylvania ? Here, small boutique wineries are not only licensed and legal but are encouraged by law. For details, contact the PA. Liquor Control Board in Harrisburg PA.

You could try to hook up with a local farmer. See MA law CH 138 sec.

19B. or go here.

Doesn't get you around the Fed. laws, but the MA fee is $22 for less than 5,000 gallons.

Andy

For a whole diffeent view, you might want to roam the back hills and valleys of say Tennesse, Kentucky, Arkansas, Missouri, and the Carolinas :-) Just be damn careful about how you make your "first contact."

Operating a winery is the third business I've done, and it's not a whole lot more of a pain than any of the others. The 23 forms the TTB (use to be ATF) has you fill out can be intimidating at first, but it's little more than just sitting down and doing it.

Others have pointed out some of the more important aspects of the legalities involved with opening a winery. I thought I'd add that it takes much more than just winemaking skills to open/operate a winery. Best to be versed a bit on business matters before taking the big leap, especially marketing. I'd place my bet for success on someone who had business skills over winemaking!

clyde

Sounds like me Clyde Been a businessman for 25 years and have done pretty well Been winemaking for 12 and done pretty crappy

HEY! If you're right and I hope you are then I'll do great!

Dave Stacy