Ian Hoare

Hi Ken,

Ian's fine. I've been recently corresponded.

Sadly he has stopped posting on AFW, citing a general drop in courtesy levels, but also a lack of relevance to the drinking habits of those of us in France. I sometimes share this view.

It would be great if Ian would rejoin us.

-E

Is this a sentence in English? Sorry an extra 'been' seems to have hung about.

-E

Great, glad to hear it.

Sorry he's stopped, but I certainly understand his point about courtesy levels.

I think so too.

LOL! It's OK, I understood anyway.

When I first started reading this group, Ian Hoare posted as much as about anyone. I am glad to hear that he is well. I was beginning to think that he was no longer with us or had moved to a very remote area without good internet access.

As for courtesy levels, this seems to vary a lot. We have had trolls who really stirred things up, but I could name many other Usenet groups that have had worse problems. Lack of courtesy on the part of some is just part of something as open as Usenet. People who have been rude to me, mostly in other groups, have for the most part been trolls who are rude to nearly everyone or people who are angry about something else. They perhaps have a boss who annoys them. They can not kick the dog, because that gets them arrested. They can not kick the spouse, because that gets them arrested as well as court actions by divorce lawyers who make them wish they never had been born. They can go to Usenet and take out their ire on someone at random who they likely do not know, and usually they can get away with it. I usually do not get upset by a tirade by someone I do not know.There seems to also be Usenet burnout. Many just seem to get tired of posting after a time.

In addition to Ian, I do not recall seeing a post from Tom S ( of Ch. Burbank fame) here in a long time. At one time he posted nearly every day. I hope he is well and perhaps just had Usenet burnout.

cwdjrxyz wrote in news:1191720945.743507.77880@

I know the burnout, I read only this newsgroup now even though there are groups that offer at least the potential for some professional advancement (read sales) Even here I am pretty much a lurker right now. I still enjoy wine Louis Jadot Macon Village tonight absolutely divine for about US $10 lots of citrus , no oak and went superbly with lobster ravioli.

Funny that you write that, because for the same reason yesterday I checked Ian's bead & breakfast site. He and Jackie quite obvilously are still at "La Souvigne" which, btw, really is located in a remote area:

and scroll down.

M.

To be honest much of the lack of courtesy in this group was self inflicted.

To protect the community here some often would chase away prospective trolls. People that might have had an internet site that sold wine etc.

I do think Ian and a couple others led these attacks on some of the "prospective trolls" instead of ignoring them.

The late Joe Rosenberg was at my home a few weeks before his death and indicated his frustration with alt.food.wine as well. He claimed that some of the "regular contributors" lost their light heartedness and became very mean spirited. He named a few very specifically. I actually tended to agree on that.

Some of us were around in the most early days of alt.food.wine. In my opinion it had became the "king of the hill" mentality for some. They took the authorship far to serious and forgot this was about the sharing of wine experiences and tasting of wine as such.

In closing I beleive Joe mentioned he had communications from Bill Loftkin on same matter. Bill can chime in if he wishes and if he is still here. He was here in the earlier days as well. Is Marcel still out there?

I feared the same thing. I've had the pleasure of meeting Ian and his wife Jacquie a couple of times, and I like them both very much.

That's certainly very true. I frequent a number of newsgroups, and all things considered, this is among the politest. But as you say, the Trolls come and go. For my part, I just killfile the obvious trolls with nothing to contribute, but that's less than a perfect solution because not everyone does, and I end up reading the trolls' messages when they are quoted by others.

Thanks for asking re Ian, Ken. I also wondered, as I looked at fr.rec.boissons.vins yesterday and he hasn't posted there, either. Glad to know he and Jacquie are well. We enjoyed having them visit in '05.

As to courtesy levels, I agree by standards of non-moderated newsgroups this one isn't particularly harsh. With one exception (who I don't remember posting much lately) few obvious trolls. And I don't remember anyone real getting a harsh reception.

Did you and Eileen make it to Westchester this summer? If so, sorry we missed you.

I also used to post here a lot, but do it less frequently these days. Combination of too many trolls and too little time.

Glad to hear Ian is doing well.

Bill Spohn

I also miss Ian's posts from the "other side of the pond". Not sure about "trolls", because I usually read only the messages posted by long time residents of this NG - unless, of course, you're referring to "UC".

C'mon back Ian! Dick R.

We did, but for a shorter than usual time. Our schedule was very tight this year, and we couldn't find the time. Sorry we missed you and Betsy too. We hope to be able to do it next year.

My view from this side of the pond, is that this is one of the more gentle newsgroups, a few trolls, yes, but usually well mannered.

I have witnessed the death of one fine newsgroup overhere, uk.rec.birdwatching. It has been poached by the vegiwarriors, who cross- post crap.

another, uk.rec gardening has seen such vitriolic personal attacks, that one wonders what goes on in British gardens.!

I have been here for a few years now, and read but do not post much.

My monthly wine club tasting is at my place tomorrow, theme is Pinot Noir. Will post notes on Wednesday.

John T

Hi John. I would agree this is one of the more gentle newsgroups for me as well.

There were quite a few of us for years that participated in this group. Several years back there were 3-4 persons, I will allow them to be nameless for now that seemed to think they were the crimewatch for this group.

It started out when someone posted and said, "I have some really nice Laguiole corkscrews I that are bone and surgical steel you can find at

Then we went from going after commerical posts to going after the perceived troll and commercial posts. Someone in this group would use IP tracking technology to identify where the person was from, what county, city, state etc.

We went from a kind group that enjoyed wine to a group that started to doubt anyone that posted if they were not already known here.

I for one don't miss postings that limit any discussion on wine including anyone that wants to sell legitimatly any wine, wine accessory etc. The person missing in this group was most adamant on the commercial post issue. There were 2-3 others that lead the charge.

Fortunatly for me most of them have me blocked and that is fine with me. I have been a member in this group almost since the beginning days and found this group has changed from being really good, civil etc....to less civil for a while. I think is back on a better track and those that were the "king of the hill" mentality and self appointed police have pretty much moved on and I wish Ian the best and I am not upset that he does not post here. But if he did, and he kept it civil I would not have an issue either. When he was civil and it was about wine...he was really a GREAT contributor.

Heard from Dale (thanks Dale) that people were asking after me. I'm fine. Thanks to those who had kind words to say.

Ian

Good to hear from you, Ian, and very glad to hear you're fine. I hope you'll stick around here for a while.

You have been missed around here. Good to hear from you again. Jim

"John T" skrev i melding news:F2lOi.411322$ snipped-for-privacy@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...

Thinking about it, this ng has been pretty peaceful for a while, hasn't it? I've been busy with other things but also lurking here part of the time. Was away last weekend drinking and tasting in Mosel, maybe a report will follow :-) Anders