Secondary & Tertiary wines in Competitions

Hello all, I need help in deciding what to do. As the Chief Coordinator for a wine competition (Chief Perpetrator to non-winners) , I am in a quandry. The wine competition that I coordinate judges both Commercial and Non-commercial side-by-side. There is nothing to prevent (as yet) anyone who wants to enter a secondary wine or tertiary wine. This past year we did have someone ( home winemaker) who entered two or three secondary wines. I got a few jaundiced looks from the judges, but the wines did fare well. However, the comments from the judges were that they really didn't care to judge secondary wines. I have since met a few other Home winemakers (homies) who make secondary and tertiary wines. My questions are; Are there any other wine competitions that have categories, or that judge secondary and tertiary wines? If you have judged wines; would you prefer not to judge secondary or tertiary wines? Is it hersy to enter a seondary wine in a wine competition? Joanne

Reply to
jmreiter
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What is the name of your competition??

Reply to
Aaron Puhala

It is a State Fair Wine Competition. No wines outside the State of New Mexico are allowed. Joanne

Reply to
jmreiter

jmreiterwrote: My questions are; Are there any other wine competitions that have categories, or that judge secondary and tertiary wines? If you have judged wines; would you prefer not to judge secondary or tertiary wines? Is it hersy to enter a seondary wine in a wine competition?

Joanne - My wine club (Greater Kansas City Cellarmasters) will have it's 5th annual contest November 8th. We have 59 categories for wines and meads but we do not distinguish between first, secondary or tertiary wines. Several of our club members make secondary wines and they are excellent. I think it depends on the winemaker and the grapes he or she has to work with. Just my opinion but I would get rid of the first, secondary or tertiary tags on your wine entries and let each wine stand on it's own. Our wine contest is only for amateur winemakers but I know many of the entries would compete very well with commercial wines.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas

Reply to
William Frazier

Bill, thanks for the reply. But I am still left pondering, as the commercial entries are all primary wines in the competition that I coordinate. Joanne

Reply to
jmreiter

Sorry to be so thick ( Stupid) but I don't understand what you mean by "primary". "secondary " & "tertiary" in relation to wines. A totally new term in my book! Presumably something to do with competition entries but I never enter any of my wines in competitions -- just not my style!

Reply to
Pinky

Hmm, when I read the post, the first thing I thought of was a "second" wine

-- that is, you take the pulp after pressing and add water and sugar (or another grape juice) and ferment that as a second wine from the same grapes. I have not heard of anyone doing this a third time (tertiary). Is this what you are talking about?

Reply to
Greg Cook

Hi Greg

In Italy after the third wine is made they will reuse the pomace one more time to make another wine. That wine is distilled and is usually clear. The liquor is known as grappa.

Regards

Frank

Reply to
Frank Mirigliano

Even at 66 years old I learn something new every day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would have reacted to 1st Pressing etc a bit sooner but I suppose Primary wine , Secondary wine is less of a mouthful than "1st pressing wine" etc. Tkx all

Reply to
Pinky

Reply to
jmreiter

Ah, thanks for the information. Now I understand how frugal Italians are!!!! :) Waste Nothing. I always wondered about grappa.

Reply to
Greg Cook

Hi Joanne

Why do the judges object to judging the secondary and tertiary wines?

Regards

Frank

Reply to
Frank Mirigliano

It would be against the law for a winery to make seconds. Tim

Reply to
Tim McNally

jmreiter wrote "But I am still left pondering, as the commercial entries are all primary wines in the competition that I coordinate."

Just curious Joanne, do you allow wine made from kits in your contest? How about fruit wines? If so, do the commercial wineries object to those entries? Also, is there some law against making a commercial wine from second pressings and addition of syrup? Seems like dilution of Concord juice with syrup is a recognized method of manufacture.

Here's an idea. Split the contest into commercial and amateur groups. Let the amateurs enter first, second or third wines. Then let the best wines from each group compete for best of show.

Bill Frazier Olathe, Kansas

Reply to
William Frazier

Bill, there is nothing in the present competition to keep a kit wine out. HOWEVER, .....there is no recognition of them either. Please keep in mind that this is a competition for Commercial wines and those very serious home winemakers who may someday become commercial. We have two classes (and I'll have two glasses!) for fruit wines, currently, Dry and Sweet. As we now have two Commercial fruit wineries in our fair state.

Before I raise the ire of some of you out there, I will point out that for those "homies" that feel intimidated by this competition that I have actively promoted the creation of "homies only" competitions among the four chapters of the New Mexico Vine & Wine Society that cover our state. In this way, kit wines could be recognized and a more relaxed atmosphere of competition could be realized for those that would not normally enter the State Fair Competition. Split the contest........HA!.......No way, will I spend the extra time to set up another competition for just Homies. It is enough agravation coordinating just one. That idea has already been discussed and not only is it logistically unfeasable, it is financially unfeasable. As I stated in the paragraph before, I have actively campaigned for each chapter to come up with its own "homies only" competition. Much easier on my senses and cheaper, too. If you knew what loops I have to go through every year, you would agree, too. Cheers, Joanne

Reply to
jmreiter

I can't help you Joanne. However, a "side-by side" competition seems very strange to me. The home winemakers have nothing to loose and everything to gain, and the commercial wineries have everything to loose and nothing to gain. How would you like to be a commercial winery that took second place to a home made wine? I am very surprised that your commercial wineries are willing to participate in such a competition. Good luck, lum

Reply to
Lum

Lum, NM has currently, about 30 wineries. Our entries, this past year, numbered 235. The fraction of serious homies who enter is small. We get along here, just fine. Before you make such blanket statements, I will point out to you that quite a few of the serious homies have now become commercial winemakers. This past year we had two or three such brand-new commercial wineries which put a serious dent in the number of entries from the homies. The homies here, are the ones who want to know if they can stack up against the commercials (play with the big boys). We have separate awards for commercial entries and the homies that win. Those Homies that place well have used their medals in their tasting rooms to thier advantage when they have gone on to become commercial. The overwhelming number of commerical entries is such that they don't mind. While we do not have professional judges, as yet, this competition (if I may say so) "ain't no greasy kid stuff" either. Commercial wineries whose wines have placed well have literally taken their medals to the bank. One such winery is now selling thier Cab Sauv for $50 per bottle -no tastings! (We've got gravitas!). Sounds like he pay off the Christmas bonuses and the time-share in Hawaii.......I hope to be there my self, someday. Joanne

Reply to
jmreiter

That depends on where the winery is located.

Andy

Reply to
JEP

Joanne, I didn't mean to upset you. Please accept my apology. lum

Reply to
Lum

Where would it be permitted?

Reply to
Negodki

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