TN Clos Ste. Hune Riesling 1976, Trimbach

Just to nit-pick. I know several top German wine producers who hate the term Petrol when referring to their. wines. This is normal for well aged fine Rieslings and sometimes some younger ones. What you are really referring to is really a mineral nose and taste and that is a term they prefer.

I have been lucky enough to have had many Clos Ste Hune and to this date the best one I have tasted,in my opinion is the 1986.

"Petrol" sounds objectionable, but can be a pleasant component. They may object, but there is a definite petrol-like aroma to some rieslings, at least to my nose.

Andy

I agree with you but the objection is the term petrol.

The problem is that "mineral" notes are quite distinct from what I, at least, pick up in many aged Rieslings (and occasionally in the young ones). If we accept that Chablis and Pouilly-Fumé are the most common examples of wines that display some mineral character, then I have no problem in saying that what I detect in Riesling is fundamentally different in nature.

Mark Lipton

I believe petrol has long been used in connection with Riesling by major critics and MWs in GB. In the US we might substitute gasoline, but that term has never caught on. One problem is that some gasoline or petrol has a very clean smell if it contains mainly aliphatic hydrocarbons and does not contain some rather nasty sulfur compounds and such. Most of the gasoline I have bought in the last few years is not very nice smelling. This could be the source of the German objection. However if you were more specific and compared the smell to pure hexane, for example, not many people other than chemists would know what you were talking about. Smell comparisons between wine and something else seldom are exact and can only suggest the true smell of the wine. Perhaps aged-Riesling smell might be a better term, although this means only those who have had several older Rieslings will know what you are talking about.

Reply to snipped-for-privacy@cwdjr.net .

In my early wine days I purchased a German Riesling, detected the "petrol" note and pitched the bottle, thinking it was contaminated. Age and experience (both mine and others) have taught me better, but I wonder how many people with my limited experience or less swore off Riesling as junk because of this?

Dean

Willi Schwengler, now retired director of Freie Weingärtner Wachau cooperative, used "petrofossil" (in German). I liked the term, but it really didn't catch on.

M.

A fossil would hardly have any smell, I believe. I'm in line with those speaking of gasoline and other oil compounds, but that's only because no one has found a commonly understood alternative description. There's a strengthening of the common mango together with some volatility which leads my thought to gasoline or kerosene - but, only a whiff or so, a small note from the flavour orchestra in a glass of old Riesling! Anders

Nor does stone smell, normally. Petrol = petroleum = oil from stone. So "petrofossil" is more or less exactly the same.

M.

Salut/Hi Sibeer,

le/on Tue, 19 Jul 2005 04:26:02 GMT, tu disais/you said:-

To complicate matters further (gd&r) I think the word is "Pétrole" which is french for what I would call (in the UK) paraffin. I think it's called Kerosene in the ex-colonies. Although my petrol/gasoline sniffing is distinctly limited, I've never found ANY old Riesling that even nearly reminded me of what I spill over my feet when I am being careless at the garage (filling station). However I HAVE noticed a smell that is faintly reminiscent of paraffin.

I have to confess that I have no problems with using expressions like "petrol", "sweaty saddle", "barnyard" and so on for aspects of wine that I like. What's your problem about using them?

When I wrote my comment I did not realize what a small tempest in a teapot it would cause. I personally do not have an objection to the term "petrol", I in fact have used the term. I only tried to say what several of my German producers friends have said. They say that many of the wine drinkers do not understand the just what the nose really means.They feel that the petrol nose indicates, to some people, a defective wine. I guess it is just a matter of education..

Yes, I have a friend who is an Alsacian producer. He told me that they were intentionally trying to change the term to "mineral" from petroleum, for marketing reasons. But a rose by any other name would smell just as sweet--or as horrible if it smelled like gasoline. In this case the wine smells of petroleum and changing the name won't change the odor.