Top 50 Restaurants in US

I wonder if this is survey is done the same way as the sister publication determines "best" hotels and resorts. they stick a ballot in the middle of the magazine with most possible choices and let the general public vote on any and all they wish. from the results in that survey, i am convinced that the ritz carlton company buys thousands of copies of the magazine and stuffs the ballot box. there is no requirement in that survey to ever have even been on the correct continent to vote for various establishments.

I >The October 2006 issue of Gourmet has a list and short description of

Hello, gerald! You wrote on Sat, 23 Sep 2006 09:48:18 -0400:

g> I once bought a gourmet to eat in the 10 or so restaurants g> chosen to be the "best" in london. Certainly 8 of the 10 g> should not have made the top 50

g> ??>> The October 2006 issue of Gourmet has a list and short ??>> description of what they consider to be the top 50 ??>> restaurants in the US. They also repeat the top 50 ??>> restaurant list for 2001. There have been many changes in ??>> 5 years.

??>> ??>> #1. Alinea in Chicago. Grant Achatz is supposed to be

??>> I wonder if this is survey is done the same way as the sister publication determines "best" hotels and resorts. they stick a ballot in the middle of the magazine with most possible choices and let the general public vote on any and all they wish. from the results in that survey, i am convinced that the ritz carlton company buys thousands of copies of the magazine and stuffs the ballot box. there is no requirement in that survey to ever have even been on the correct continent to vote for various establishments. ??>>

I wonder if you could get a survey from an insert in the Journal of the American Medical Association? An honest cardiologist might have to downgrade most of Gourmet's choices even if they probably could afford them!

James Silverton Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.comcast.not

Did it mention the methodology of its picks? I wonder how many people have eaten at Masa. I always find these list fascinating- the Restaurant Magazine list had WD-50 and Spice Market among the 50 best in the world, but this list doesn't have them in 50 best in US. Both lists include Gramercy Tavern, which I love, but partly because of it's predictableness- not in the same league creatively as say Manresa. I'm not sure I knowa single food-obsessed NYer who counts Babbo as the best place in city. I like Fore Street in Maine, but could name 10 NY places I think are better. I know a bunch of people who've eaten at Magnolia Grill (I haven't)- they liked, but 11th best in country? This list looks like some folks sat around picking names they knew- "ok, give me a Southern one...how about Tx? .....did we mention New England yet....hey, we have lots of Northern CA but we need to throw in some SoCal" ...I'm just a nitpicker I guess.

cwdjrxyz wrote:

"DaleW" in news: snipped-for-privacy@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com :

I'd say, on the contrary, those looked like pretty astute observations. For what my opinion is worth. -- M

BTW to Mark's incidental comment on wine pricing of "200-300%," I don't know about all regions, but a 2.5 ratio is fairly standard for Bay Area fine dining and relates somewhat to the food-cost ratio though details differ. Many restaurants permit or encourage bottles brought in. (We routinely brought our own wines to Panisse when I ate there occasionally as a starving student. 1976 Gevrey-Chambertins, 1971 Fixins -- I don't mean anything ironic here, these were good-value wines, snapped up occasionally when the values surfaced, carefully saved for suitable food occasions.)

The article with the list says nothing about the methodology. However the table of contents has a short paragraph that says: "And how do you narrow a field of thousands down to a mere 50. It wasn't easy, but it sure was fun." So I guess ratings are based on Gourmet staff evaluations. Gourmet now reviews restaurants all over the US, so they do have some experience with many restaurants. I would guess that Ruth Reichl, editor in chief of Gourmet, had as much to do with the list as anyone. She took over Gourment several years ago, and there soon were drastic changes. I believe she was a restaurant reviewer for the NY Times before going to Gourmet. She impresses me as a woman who usually gets her way, although I have never met her.

Now for NYC. Besides Per Se in a tie for 3rd with The French Laundry, other NYC entries are: 7- Masa; 9- Daniel; 10- Le Bernardin; 17- Babbo;

27- Jean Gorges; 34- Gramercy Tavern. Absent from this list, but on the 2001 list are: 19- Nobu; 37- Gotham Bar and Grill; 49- Peter Luger Steak House (Brooklyn).

Chez Panisse was #1 on the 2001 list and Gene Georges was #2.

Of course any such "best of" list always causes much discussion because individual tastes vary quite a bit.

I was surprised to find Locke-Ober in Boston to be rated as #18 on the new list. I ate there once when I was young (quite a few years ago).It was something out of the late 1800s in a luxary hotel dining room style. It would not have been out of place to have seen ladies in hoop skirts and bustles. Many of the regulars likely came over on the Mayflower. Apparently the decor is still much in the old style. However their present chef, Lydia Shire, has turned this restaurant upside down. Apparently she has managed to keep many of the old regulars despite predictions to the contrary. She has brought in many new customers as well. Some of her dishes sound quite radical, such as rum-and-tobacco smoked salmon.

I had a 1/2 bottle of JL Chave Hermitage last year and the price was like $75 for a half.

Where I live in NC that would be just about the retail price. So its all relative.

I stand by my comments that Chez Panisse is the best restaurant I have eaten at in North America. That said I have not been to French Laundry and I have heard it too is without doubt excellent. I am sure I would love it but cannot get in no matter how hard I have tried.

Chez Panisse I get into every trip to SF/ Napa as I call well in advance.

Max, I only added that comment to address those who might view the word "bargain" as meaning close to retail in price rather than low in price. I agree that Chez Panisse's pricing is completely in line (if not better) with most of its peers'. My point was that there is a plentitude of low priced wines on Chez Panisse's wine list, many of which are more than just drinkable.

Mark Lipton

An old friend of Adele's was a food editor at Gourmet for many years. We were privy to their methods rating the Paris places. They'd ship the entire editorial staff over for a week, and every meal would be at a leading restaurant en mass -- though I believe they did split of the whole group. They ate together and passed food around, so it was anything but discreet. I believe that places towards the beginning of the week had a substantial advantage over later ones, when palate saturation surely set in.

-E

Cwdjrxyz, I guess I just get frustrated at the word "best," when there is no clear guide to (1) who did the choosing, (2) if multiple visits were required, and especially (3) what criteria did they use?

1) I enjoyed Ruth Reichl's reviews when she was with the Times (and Betsy has enjoyed her books). But I would be curious as to how many staffers were involved, and how many staffers needed to vote to place a restaurant on the list.

2) I believe the Times requires the reviewer to visit the restaurant at least 3 times before a review can be issued. I'm curious as to the Gourmet policy. Masa seats 10 at bar, plus I think 2 tables. How many staffers did Gourmet send (at $300/pop before drinks, tax, and tip) before declaring it in top 10? Masa also made the Restaurant magazine list, though it had been opened a few months - I had the same question.

3) this is the biggie to me. Is it based solely on food, do decor and service count equally to the food, or is primarily on food but with significant attention to the other two? Is excellent service in a casual style (think Danny Meyers' places such as Eleven Mad, Union Sq, Gramercy) considered as good as more formal French ala Jean-George, Daniel, A. Ducasse?

Lugers may well have what many people think of as the best steak in the US. Yet with its shortcomings of decor, service, and winelist, I can easily see it not being on such a list (of course, some people think the anti-decor and crusty staff make it even better). I'm surprised Gotham would have made the list even in 2001.

I'm not criticizing this list as such, I found it interesting (and actually probably better researched than the Restaurant "50 Best in World" - I seriously doubt most of the writers who voted for Spice Market had been there - it hadn't been opened long, just like Masa). I do wish Gourmet had entitled it something such as "50 Restaurants We Really Love" rather than such a definitive "50 Best", but I guess that would sell less.

Most 'best' restaurant lists don't use the same criteria I would. Often they only list so called 5 star ultra expensive posh restaurants frequented by the rich and famous. Usually those restaurants are not the type I enjoy and absurd prices are often not the main problem I have. I prefer small one of a kind out of the way restaurants that are not the trendy place to be.

One of my favorite restaurants will never make any national top list. It's too small and in a small city to get recognition. Thats something that makes it all the more special. Lack of tourists!! It's an old converted house in a residential neighborhood. Hard to beat! Wine Spectator has mentioned it briefly many times. The wine list on their website is only a small fraction of what they have.

If ever in Flagstaff on the way to the Grand Canyon make it a stop.

Miles, Some time when you're visiting Amador County, take Hwy 88 over the Carson Pass to 395 and then South to Bridgeport. There, go to 1881 Restaurant

which is close to what you've just described, although without nearly such an extensive wine list. Still, it's quite a surprise to find such a nice fine dining establishment in such a remote location.

Mark Lipton

Thanks Mark. That looks exactly like the type of restaurant I really enjoy. Small, quiet, not trendy, touristy etc. These types of restaurants aren't easy to find. I'd like to visit Amador again soon. It's been several years since I've been there. I usually go in May when the Sacramento Jazz Festival occurs. I may also visit in Sept. during the Reno Air Races.

miles wrote in news:w01Sg.1558$tO5.267@fed1read10:

And how much do they pay for the Wine Spectator recognition? You do know there is a fee for that? Don't you?

"miles" wrote ...........

Now you understand why this is a very small world.

In 1985 or 86 I was working in the US (actually, I was being hosted by an American company whose products I sold in the NZ market) and spent a week in Arizona.

I had driven across from Bakersfield, through Barstow and Needles (at the time I was unaware I was driving the famous Route 66!) and stayed in Flagstaff, before heading up to the Grand Canyon.

I was hosted out to dinner - guess where?

Yes, Cottage Place Restaurant. I had forgotten the name - and recall nothing about what I consumed - but I vividly remember the building - as soon as I saw it on the web site.

Thanks for the link.

I also remember dining at Mancuso's at Borgata in Scottsdale, a bizarre OTT place rather styled like a medieval castle.

Again, I was being hosted, and have no specific memory of the meal or ines - but I was really impressed by the following.

It must have been August / maybe September (I could work it out - I ran the Santa Monica Sports & Arts Festival Marathon a couple weeks after my sojourn in Az!!!) - but it was very hot in Phoenix.

I arrived at Mancuso's sans jacket and tie - but, calmly and professionally, I was ushered into a small anteroom and fitted with both jacket and tie - and I rejoined my hosts within 30 seconds.

For a hick NZer, this was an amazing service.

Maybe it is time for a return visit.