What wine do I like?

Try a few other inexpensive Spanish wines - Almansa etc., or some Portuguese offerings - Dao perhaps.

Sardinian Cannonau is similar, if you can find it.

Regards, Dean

Sangre de Toro is a very nice everyday red. The two grapes it's made from are called Grenache and Carignan in France, and wines of (somewhat) similar character are produced in the South of France in the Cotes du Rhone and Coteaux du Languedoc appelations. If you can find the Cotes du Rhones from some of the big negociants (Perrin, Chapoutier, Jaboulet, Guigal), try them -- they should be in the same price range as the Sangre de Toro. Alternatively, there are a lot of decent wines being made in the Costieres de Nimes at the mouth of the Rhone, but I don't know what you're likely to find. Mas de Bressades, Mas Carlot and Ch. Campuget are three that are easy to find where I live.

HTH Mark Lipton

Try some Cal. Napa Valley reds, I suggest Cabernet Sauvignon, Northern Cal. or Washington Pinot Noires & my personal all American red favorie Zinfandel. There is one inexpensive French wine that is under $10.00 (american), is complex & could even stand 5 or 10 years aging. A real bargain & a lovely wine. A 1998 (among others) Cote de Rhone. A delightfully underpriced wine with the complexity of a much more expensive wine. Season's Eatings (& drinkings)

After Malvern Hill Pres. Lincoln visited with Gens. Mc Clellen & Sumner as well as Col. Nugent (Commander of the Irish Brigade.)` A Lt. James. M. Birmingham, Adjutant of the 88th N. Y. came from a swim in the James R. & with his underwear drying on his body saw them talking. He ducked behind some cover to eavesdrop in time to see & hear Pres. Lincoln (overcome with emotion at the bravery & sacrifice of the Irish Brigade.) as he lifted a corner of the 69th N. Y.'s flag, kissed it & said "God bless this Irish flag" From Joseph Bilby's book "Remember Fontenoy" on the Irish Brigade Lancaster Civil War Round Table Website

You aren't going to find many decent Washinton state pinots (even if you spell it correctly); the best area for that particular varietal is Oregon, not Washington.

Look, I know you are a webtv wonk, but appending a totally irrelevant and exceptionally lengthy sig file will win you no friends here, or elsewhere. In fact after a while (VERY soon now) most of us will stop reading what you have to say, whether or not it happens to be right.

] ] ] Rich wrote: ] ] >

] > The red in question is Sangre de Torro, from Torres, and describes ] > itself as made from Garnacha and Carinena grapes. I like it because ] > its fruity, not bitter, and £5 seems quite reasonable. ] ] Sangre de Toro is a very nice everyday red. The two grapes it's made ] from are called Grenache and Carignan in France, and wines of (somewhat) ] similar character are produced in the South of France in the Cotes du ] Rhone and Coteaux du Languedoc appelations. If you can find the Cotes ] du Rhones from some of the big negociants (Perrin, Chapoutier, Jaboulet, ] Guigal), try them -- they should be in the same price range as the ] Sangre de Toro. Alternatively, there are a lot of decent wines being ] made in the Costieres de Nimes at the mouth of the Rhone, but I don't ] know what you're likely to find. Mas de Bressades, Mas Carlot and Ch. ] Campuget are three that are easy to find where I live. ] Hi Mark and Rich,

Good advice. I like Sangre de Toro too, although I've found it a bit acidic in some vintages. Best advice is, if you like the vintage, lay a couple of cases in.

Sadly most of the CdRs Mark mentions are now a little more expensive than your 5 quid...

Here's one you'll like, if you can find it. A nice, generous and easy drinking red with simple sunny fruit -- maybe a little more open then the SdT.

Caringole -- Domaine La Croix Belle Vin de Pays des Cotes de Thongue J & F Boyer -- (Puissalicon)

Price a whopping 3.90 EU a bottle from the _store_. Also available in BiB for < 3 EU/l.

A really nice unstinting everyday drink. Shows that good bargains do exist!

-E

I am well versed in wine from the predications in German wines to the great growths of Bordeaux, Just because I'm no snob like you & have my own preferrence in wine. you look down your nose at anyone with a different opinion than yourself. I could buy & sell you in wine kowledge. My choosing webtv has nothing to do with my love of wine or my Civil War interest. I spend my time & money preserving our heritage while you atempt to be a negative al knowing self centered jerk. Why not enjoy the pleasures of wine & food & quit the ascerbic & very abrasive snobbery. I take great pride in my CW work & find you a most offensive & negative person. Washington Pinot Noirs ARE better than most Cal. versions

After Malvern Hill Pres. Lincoln visited with Gens. Mc Clellen & Sumner as well as Col. Nugent (Commander of the Irish Brigade.)` A Lt. James. M. Birmingham, Adjutant of the 88th N. Y. came from a swim in the James R. & with his underwear drying on his body saw them talking. He ducked behind some cover to eavesdrop in time to see & hear Pres. Lincoln (overcome with emotion at the bravery & sacrifice of the Irish Brigade.) as he lifted a corner of the 69th N. Y.'s flag, kissed it & said "God bless this Irish flag" From Joseph Bilby's book "Remember Fontenoy" on the Irish Brigade Lancaster Civil War Round Table Website

Please name a few specific examples of these Washington Pinot Noirs that are better than California versions. I'd like to try them and compare notes with you.

Dana

If you say so.

Don't be ridiculous.

SPLONK!!!

All the best Ian (To reply by email PLEASE don't use "Reply to" but use my name at wanadoo.fr) Thanks.

snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (E. Carl Speros) wrote in news:18858-3FE3DB55-136 @storefull-3114.bay.webtv.net:

There was no snobbery in Bill's response. I would be reluctant however, to take the advice that all 98 Cotes du Rhones are wonderful and available at under 10USD. 98's are disappearing for one thing and not all winemakers are equal.

To say that CdR is a usually a good buy is certainly not something with which I would disagree just as I find most Chianti's (some pigs however are more equal than others) to be good all round wines and a good go to call when one is looking for a present does not know the tastes of the recipient.

In CdR try looking for Domaine Richaud and Domaine Garance (both Cairanne village), Domaine Gramenon, Cooperative d'Estezargues (fab coop wine at $5), Domaine Viret.

Mike

] On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 14:31:56 GMT, jcoulter ] wrote: ] ] > snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (E. Carl Speros) wrote in news:18858-3FE3DB55-136 ] >@storefull-3114.bay.webtv.net: ] >

] >> I am well versed in wine from the predications in German wines to the ] >> great growths of Bordeaux, Just because I'm no snob like you & have my ] >> own preferrence in wine. you look down your nose at anyone with a ] >> different opinion than yourself. I could buy & sell you in wine ] >> kowledge. My choosing webtv has ] >

This doesn't dignify a response. Obviously Bill is one of the most informed of our regulars. E. Carl, you can only make yourself sound foolish with this kind of diatribe.

] >There was no snobbery in Bill's response. I would be reluctant however, to ] >take the advice that all 98 Cotes du Rhones are wonderful and available at ] >under 10USD. 98's are disappearing for one thing and not all winemakers are ] >equal. ] ] In CdR try looking for Domaine Richaud and Domaine Garance (both ] Cairanne village), Domaine Gramenon, Cooperative d'Estezargues (fab ] coop wine at $5), Domaine Viret. ]

Mike,

Good luck finding Richaud for < $10 US!! A great producer, I've been a client for many years (since before he became "known") but the prices have gotten beyond me, sadly.

Josh, you might also look for some excellent coop wines from rasteau, beaumes de venise, vaqueyras, visan. All around 5 eu, and well made wines.

-E

I'm still waiting for the names of these WA PNs.

Dana

I guess I got into this conversation late but, unfortunately, Pinot Noir is a lost cause in Washington State. The climate is just not hospitable to this very finicky grape. It can be grown for sparkling wine because such a use requires an early harvest when acidity levels are still high. There are a few areas of Western Washington (99% or so of Washington's wine grapes are grown in Eastern Washington) that can grow Pinot Noir. But my experiences with wines made from these grapes have convinced me that PN is best left to our neighbors to the south (Oregon and California).

Vino

And I enjoy and am proficient in cross country skiing and biking, but I limit such discussions on a wine newsgroup

Just in case I was one of those conpiracy theorists who tended to distrust conventional wisdom (eg WA is the place to grow Merlot and Cabernet, OR is the place to grow Pinot Noir, or more extreme- the Holocaust happened), I got to try WA (Yakima Valley) wines first-hand this summer.

1. Most of the Reds were Cabernet, Merlot, Shiraz, or combinations therof.

1. The couple of Pinot Noir I did try were light and simple.

And no, I don't think Oregon Pinot Noirs are necessarily better than the California renditions, but I have little experience with the latter.

Tom Schellberg

Thanks to all for the suggestions. I feel a spending spree coming on...